Hello all,
The notes, recordings and transcripts for CCWG Accountability WS2 Jurisdiction Subgroup Meeting #2 – 8 September 2016 will be available here: https://community.icann.
org/x/YhKsAw
A copy of the notes may be found below.
Thank you.
With kind regards,
Brenda Brewer
MSSI Projects & Operations Assistant
ICANN - Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers
Notes
Welcome/Admin
Tatiana Tropina audio only
for the moment. No changes to SOIs.
• Meeting Time Rotation
Greg Shatan: will rotate
between 1300 and 1900 slots leaving aside the 0500. May vary days of the week but will avoid 1900 on Friday. Kavouss Arasteh: could we
shift 1900 to 2000? Bernard Turcotte: Schedule
will be reviewed with change to daylight savings later in the fall. • Work Plan and Schedule
Overview (attached). Looking to have a deliverable complete in February 2017. Greg Shatan: This work plan
assumes we are a Complex project. Presentation of the slide. Milton Mueller: this schedule
seems unrealistic to me. We take 2.5 months to develop a work plan and don't talk substance until December, then we complete our " deliverable" in only one month? David McAuley: We may be able
to get into substance by asking participants to contribute to a gap analysis between the accountability framework that is being implemented vs its applicability vs jurisdictions. Greg Shatan: Need a rolling
list of action items. The first item should be this gap analysis. Farzaneh Badii: Greg as to
gap analysis you say in the doc that: I think there was a general conclusion that ICANN' s current jurisdiction didn't result in any significant " gaps"
relating to ICANNaccountability. Whether there is a formal "gap analysis" is another question, and one we need to explore. David McAuley: Do not
remember any formal gap analysis from WS1. This is about the settlement of disputes jursidiction. Kavouss Arasteh: there was no formal
conclusion in WS1 that there was no gap. Kavouss Arasteh: was NOTa
general conclusion that ICANN' s current jurisdiction didn't result in any significant " gaps" relating to ICANN accountability. Whether there is a
formal "gap analysis" isanother question, and one we need to explore. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland): We
had very general discussions - that is what we did... Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland): anyw
ay what is on the ws1 final papers is what represents our agreements... David McAuley: agree w/
Kavouss re gap - we have to check • Plan to Develop Detailed
Work Plan & Schedule • Plan for September/
October (see attached) • Suggestions for
overall Work Plan • Our Goal is a
Deliverable • Discussion of Scope
• Do we begin with
Scope? • Jordan
Carter lightning talk suggested being “upfront about our interests” • Detailed Reading
of Google Doc (Staff Paper, as revised and annotated by Members of Subgroup) Kavouss Arasteh: Not in favor of
Applicable Law? Greg Shatan: no issue since
it is in Annex 12. David McAuley: disputes
should include legal actions vs ICANN in various jurisdictions? Milton Mueller: so
jurisdictional effects on two distinct things: 1) accountability mechanisms; 2) actual operation of policies ( whatever that means) And by 2) we are referring
primarily to disputeresolution jorge cancio (GAC Switzerland)
: At the same time we saidthat this refers "primarily" to 1) settlement of disputes, including choice of jurisdiction and applicable laws, what disputes "within ICANN" means could also be useful. Greg Shatan: Within ICANN implies actors within
ICANN but it would seem undluly restrictive to say this only includes ICANN's internal dispute resolution processes. jorge cancio (GAC Switzerland)
: within ICANN I guesscovers all parties affected by ICANN decisions and which may bring an internal claim against it. Kavouss Arasteh: why NOT NECESSARILY?
David McAuley: From WS1
recollection the NECESSARILY comes in if the gap analysis notes that the accountability mechanisms are broken ( material problem) because of jurisdiction. Edward Morris: My
recollection is the same as David's David McAuley: Thanks Kavouss,
and I think that is part of our task. Good question you asked. Milton Mueller: I think many
of these points could be best pursued on the list, in writing David McAuley: +1 Milton
Avri Doria: so ICANN is only
incorporated in one place and these lesser 'registrations' do not affect jurisdiction? Registrations and their relation to incorporation are essentially different with respect to jurisdictional obligations? Is so where are jurisdictional issues related to multiple registrations dealt with? Vinay Kesari: Agree with Paul.
I think ICANN has gone on record stating specifically that local offices are subject to local laws on issues such as employment. Kavouss Arasteh: best to use both
email list and Google doc. As to this question is it not too detailed at this time? Avri Doria: what is the
status of the ICANN presence in non-US jurisdiction? Greg Shatan: Action Item -
this should be answered by ICANN legal. Samantha Eisner: We have to
adhere to laws that allow us to have offices in different locations but I can confirm that we have not incorporated in any other location Samantha Eisner: ICANN
typically is a "branch" location or a registered foreign office equivalent Jeff Neuman: I would like to
know the difference between " Engagement Centers", "HUBs", " Offices", etc/ Avri Doria: Not incorporated? Also not registered as some
sort of company? Jeff Neuman: Is there a way
to get those definitions from ICANN staff? Jeff Neuman: I have to admit
I never understood Fadi's distinctions Samantha Eisner: Yes, Jeff
Greg Shatan: Will start the next version
of the google doc and circulate. Vinay Kesari: Hi Avri, many
countries (India for example) allow a foreign company to set up a
representative/ branch officelocally. This is not a separate legal entity, can't sue/ be sued. But it
requires a registration• Creation of Scope
Document? • Other Potential Inputs to
our Work • More Detailed
Review of Lightning Talks • Pertinent
Literature (influenced by Scope) • Experts/Legal
Advice • AOB
• Adjourn
Greg Shatan: Adjourned
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