I see a lot of positive progress in Avri's ideas hereunder.

Thank you Avri


Carlos Raúl Gutiérrez
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On Oct 5, 2015, at 8:49 AM, Avri Doria <avri@acm.org> wrote:

Hi,

What about the idea of recasting the SM to work on a consensus model
instead of voting?

The info we got from Sidley/Adler indicates that this should be
possible.  Then instead of working on votes we can work on
Recommendations and Advice objections to gauge consensus (e.g. no more
that 1 SO recommends against + 1 AC advises against)

Note: I personally accept that constant outreach, a place for anyone in
an ACSO and open comment period in the 6 UN languages meets the
condition for a viable global model of participation.

avri

On 05-Oct-15 10:31, Kavouss Arasteh wrote:
Jordan,
We should not pusjh to a particular model SMM  while we have
disagreement a) from the Board and b) from people among CCWG ,in
partzicular, if the voting arrangements are maintained and if most of
the ACs refrain to pop in/ or opt for voting and c) indication from
others that with such voting by the ACs the balance between the
private sectors and others, on the one hand, and governments on the
other hand is c ompromised,
We need to listen to each others and not to few that have already
agreed to SMM.
Pls kindly understand that there is diverghence of views .$
Let us find out a consensus along the line that was proposed by Stev
and amended by me
Tks
Kavouss  

2015-10-05 16:25 GMT+02:00 Kavouss Arasteh <kavouss.arasteh@gmail.com
<mailto:kavouss.arasteh@gmail.com>>:



   2015-10-05 15:38 GMT+02:00 Matthew Shears <mshears@cdt.org
   <mailto:mshears@cdt.org>>:

       + 1 also

       On 05/10/2015 13:54, James M. Bladel wrote:
       +1. 

       Any claims that we must abbreviate accountability reforms in
       order to fit the IANA transition timeline has those two
       priorities reversed. 

       Sent via iPhone. Blame Siri. 


       On Oct 2, 2015, at 19:44, Jordan Carter
       <jordan@internetnz.net.nz <mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz>>
       wrote:

       Thanks Avri for this nice statement of one of the key
       dilemmas facing this group.

       The divergence between:

       - the transition can't happen until accountability is
       sustainable, and so that requires the member model as a
       foundation

       and

       - the transition can't happen if there is a significant
       change such as that to a member model, and so that requires
       ruling out the member model


       is quite stark.

       FWIW my instincts are in line with Avri's. If ICANN's
       current level of accountability was acceptable, the
       community would not have demanded an accountability process
       alongside the transition process, and NTIA would not have
       agreed the two had to be intertwined and interrelated.


       cheers
       Jordan


       On 1 October 2015 at 10:38, Avri Doria <avri@acm.org
       <mailto:avri@acm.org>> wrote:

           Hi,

           The  Board's critique rests on a notion that the
           introduction of
           anything new in the ICANN system will be a destabilizing
           factor and most
           be avoided.

           This ignores the fact that by removing the NTIA backstop
           we destabilize
           the current system. It might have been possible to find
           a new balance
           (not that the old worked that well given the amount of
           discontent that
           existed prior to the CCWG process) by tweaking the
           system.  The early
           work of the CCWG, however, showed that this was not
           enough.  So we
           decided to bring back a notion that existed in the early
           ICANN design,
           the idea of membership.  Membership has always been part
           of the kit that
           was available to ICANN in the multistakeholder model. 
           An initial
           experiment met with some issues and instead of fixing
           that then, they
           threw the notion away without exploring possible tweaks
           to the system.
           As a result we are living in ICANN 2.0, a system that
           was  imposed in a
           top down manner and one that was never fully accepted by
           those at the
           bottom.

           Now, albeit in a very different configuration, the CCWG
           is proposing to
           establish a community consensus based idea of
           membership. I believe that
           this should be given a fair analysis before rejecting
           it.  It is also
           important to remember that the NTIA requirements were
           not a prohibition
           of new mechanisms or structures, but rather evidence
           that these
           structure did not increase the current risk, or fact, of
           capture and
           that they could be held to account.

           The Board criticism is important to look at for
           arguments that show the
           areas in which the CCWG plan either does not explain its
           protections
           against capture and its accountability checks and
           balances or may have
           gaps in these areas. If we cannot explain what we
           propose, or cannot
           close the gaps, then it becomes time to consider
           variations on the model
           or another model altogether. In my opinion, we are not
           there.

           avri


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