[I've moved this discussion to the ALAC list.]

Yes, we can put it on the agenda if there is a general wish. And of course be cursed because we choose to talk about process...

This is definitely not the first time we have had the discussion, and it is not still with us because we chose to drop it, but it a really difficult one.

We are continuously torn between too wide a distribution of something that in truth, not many want to receive, and the need to be open, transparent and seeking input from all and sundry.

As a small example, our rules require that messages related to ALAC officer selections go to ALAC-Announce, a list including all ALS representatives, a host of other people who have self-subscribed and probably other who I am not aware of. The messages also got to the ALAC list. None of the people on the Announce list (who are not also on the ALAC list) can nominate or vote in the selection. But we send it out because we are open and transparent. If we didn't, we would no doubt be accused of working under a dark, secretive shroud.

The problem seems to have arisen at this point because of the coincidence of two events:

1. The distribution of a pointer to Board Candidate Q&A responses sent by staff to the RALO lists, the At-Large list and the ALAC-Announce list causing many people to get three copies.

2. The recent completion of a project to collect accurate e-mail addresses for ALS primary and secondary contacts, resulting in all of those who were "new" to us being subscribed to various lists, apparently (this I am not sure of) without informing them that it was happening and why.

Several years ago I did a massive correlation of our various lists to try to see if any lists were largely subsets or supersets of others to eliminate multiple messages being received. The summary result was that there was no pattern. There are people on the RALO lists who were not on the At-Large list, and there were people on the At-Large list who were not on any RALO list. Similarly for the ALAC-Announce list. I could go on, but you probably get the picture.

Alan

At 19/02/2017 02:34 PM, Holly Raiche wrote:

Folks

A great discussion on this list - making some really important points. So instead of letting the matter drop (as is so often the case), make this an item for discussion at CPH - and allow plenty of time. How do we communicate, can we do better and how.

So maybe review what some of us know - what are the lists, how are they used (or not), when people unsubscribe, do we try to find out why, is there a better way to communicate - by topic? And Dev, Garth, Seun and everyone - could there be a page or so - to that list and staff, saying this is a better way and this is how to do it.

We are starting the Review comments - and how we communicate (and how we could do it better) is clearly something that should be one of the top items on that agenda. So let?s actually make our communications structures better rather than just complain

Thanks everyone

Holly
On 20 Feb 2017, at 4:57 am, Roberto Gaetano < roberto_gaetano@hotmail.com> wrote:
Oh good, then we can agree.
R

Da: gbruen@knujon.com [mailto:gbruen@knujon.com]
Inviato: domenica 19 febbraio 2017 18:55
A: Roberto Gaetano
Cc: at-large@atlarge-lists.icann.org
Oggetto: Re: R: [At-Large] Unsubscribe me please

<< OTOH, your point is to replace email with something different, I am strongly against.>>

Hardly Roberto, I want people to have CHOICE and the system to be flexible. Have a web interface that allows people to subscribe to the issue they are concerned about and when they respond via email to a thread it is placed somewhere useful within the interface so people who do NOT use the email list can still interact with you. The overlay of a properly configured interface would also allow people to use the system in a LOCAL language if they choose.

On 2/19/17 12:46 PM, Roberto Gaetano wrote:
Garth,

I am not arguing on the fact that there are other solutions, what I reacted was to the idea of dropping the email.

What is *better* or *much better* is really a matter of different taste, connectivity conditions (bandwidth, cost, etc.), way to use (always online or not), and more.

What is good for some, is bad for other.

If your point is that ICANN should explore alternatives and add them to the offer they give to the stakeholders, I am with you.

If, OTOH, your point is to replace email with something different, I am strongly against.

Cheers,

Roberto

Da: gbruen@knujon.com [mailto:gbruen@knujon.com]

Inviato: domenica 19 febbraio 2017 18:24

A: Roberto Gaetano

Cc: at-large@atlarge-lists.icann.org

Oggetto: Re: [At-Large] Unsubscribe me please

Roberto,

There is a much better way. Web technology has evolved considerably, It is entirely possible to have a single interface where all At-Large participants can review current issues and collaborate in queues and streams. Instead of cobbling together a bunch of disparate systems for placing and tracking At-Large work, can we put all the tools in one place like every other effective organization has done. We're not using anything even close to workflow, none of the At-Large "Stuff" is results or goal driven. Log into this for that, log into this other thing for something else. This is a case study in driving our work into the ground.

-Garth
On 2/19/17 11:35 AM, Roberto Gaetano wrote:
To me, it works well - or at least better than some alternatives.

But maybe there other ways that I don't know.

Anyway, please do not unsubscribe me :)

R

Sent from my iPad
On 19 Feb 2017, at 17:13, "gbruen@knujon.com" <gbruen@knujon.com> wrote:
Seun, there are always too many emails, none channeled to specific interests or needs. This decades-old "system" of collaboration and information flow is one of the great failures of ICANN to engage with the community. Why would anyone want to stay engaged?
On 2/19/17 10:46 AM, Seun Ojedeji wrote:
Hello,

The URL to unsubscribe is in the footer:

https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large

On that note, I wonder why a few people are unsubscribing? Are the mails too much already ;-)

Regards

Sent from my LG G4

Kindly excuse brevity and typos

On Feb 19, 2017 16:38, "Alexander Forsyth" <aforsyth.pdp@gmail.com > wrote:

Thank you.

Alexander Forsyth

www.campominado.org

www.alexanderforsyth.com

_______________________________________________

At-Large mailing list

At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org

https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large

At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org
_______________________________________________
At-Large mailing list
At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org
https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large
 
At-Large Official Site:
http://atlarge.icann.org
-- 
Garth Bruen
gbruen@knujon.com
 
617-947-3805
http://www.knujon.com
ICANN At-Large Advisory Council
Author: WHOIS Running the Internet
http://www.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1118679555.html
_______________________________________________

At-Large mailing list

At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org

https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large

At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org
-- 
Garth Bruen
gbruen@knujon.com
 
617-947-3805
http://www.knujon.com
ICANN At-Large Advisory Council
Author: WHOIS Running the Internet
http://www.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1118679555.html
-- 
Garth Bruen
gbruen@knujon.com
 
617-947-3805
http://www.knujon.com
ICANN At-Large Advisory Council
Author: WHOIS Running the Internet
http://www.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1118679555.html
_______________________________________________
At-Large mailing list
At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org
https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large

At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline
X-Microsoft-Exchange-Diagnostics:
1;DM5PR03MB2714;9:CR/BPNVTrAfzmM68kQQXnk2O1lzsYt865O5AvDu1isILQZEk58T15ssWC5Sv+onrLpYJv+V/yBsUTMXboMrkjTu6Qbgo5hudRMImGTJTx7dqK57RfdKHW66XYXJUL/dgg0ISfgZ4MmnXAcMr6SoTImZSYbNxA3hm3ej4hzwz9QwEUXI5HCFmkem1oBbs062IkLGkrzh2TXvxAFmoux10lXnZSfN44zSF5P/u/mtVS3p3LkuNo+qnWAc/Te7EirwQm0a2pZq/Ls0lTWXS8MuBH0/gUu/eQRlseU/L9QrSEQDzJQVifnW4qZt/SwDoI+mnC/Ac+GIxg2iQfOEFYupuzfdAxIP/cHq/YM3/aWkICDa0uXOb1XUmzketL7evNG1sEwUPqKfLk27jXOzwlPqX8yZBEJwsG9BcTbXdfjTWE4HY0OMxdkUz5+puJc3yZoS/
X-Microsoft-Antispam-Mailbox-Delivery:
ex:0;auth:0;dest:I;ENG:(20160514016)(520000050)(520002050)(750028);

_______________________________________________
At-Large mailing list
At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org
https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large

At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org