Late for appointment now. Will reply when next have connectivity. Alan At 13/10/2008 08:56 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:

Alan: Actually, this issues report might just be doing exactly what you caution me against; "blow this out of proportion"!

Plainly put, I'm saying an Issues Report is premature.....at best! And I'm saying this against the background of the several others that have coursed themselves through the process with, well, uneven results to date.

Here's the killjoy. By your own reckoning, "the vast majority are honouring all contracts and agreements 100%"; presumably, that "vast majority" phrase refers registrars and/or resellers?

Which begs the question......

Ach...the irony of my response..even by invoking an "Evanism"......got lost in the shuffle..........

Carlton

-----Original Message----- From: alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Alan Greenberg Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 05:31 PM To: 'ALAC Working List' Subject: Re: [ALAC] Draft of the Request for Issues Report

The draft request does allude to some possible violation of contracts, specifically cases where a registrar or reseller acts in bad faith by not issuing appropriate notices or honouring auto-renewal agreements.

But please do not blow this out of proportion. In my estimation (and there is no body of actual statistics available), this is a small fraction of the cases we are talking about in the overall Issues Report request. The vast majority are honouring all contracts and agreements 100%.

We may not like the terms of those agreements, and this is a way to go about having them unilaterally changed. Even if registrars don't like it. That is what the concept of consensus policies is all about. If enough of the community supports a change, it will happen.

For cases that actually do include a breach of contract, we are also asking that ICANN ramp up enforcement and provide paths for registrant complaint.

Alan

At 13/10/2008 02:44 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:

...

To use an "Evanism", let me see if I get this straight.

We believe we have a situation with "Post-expiry Domain Recovery by the original registrant" that undermines the interests of users; the registrants. The updated draft request document - a well-written tome, in my opinion! - gives chapter and verse, the background to the problem and the existing ICANN Registrar/Registry related policies that were intended to ameliorate said problem; the RGP and the AGP.

It identifies the reason for the "repeated injuries and usurpations" experienced by registrants; the lack of contract enforcement by ICANN and the disability/disinclination of some registrants to access remedies via the UDRP.

There is no acknowledgement that contracts between parties are well dissected in the tort law with remedies available in law and equity.

So what is the ALAC recommending here? An issues report, the sum total of which cannot be more than to tell ICANN it went to sleep on its own contract enforcement!

I say again: IMHO, the ALAC pronouncements around contracts of one or other kind tends to impairment on the applicability of tort laws to commercial transactions. So now, I dare to ask this: "What do we know and when did we know it?"

Carlton Samuels

-----Original Message----- From: alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Alan Greenberg Sent: Friday, October 10, 2008 06:47 PM To: ALAC Working List Subject: [ALAC] Draft of the Request for Issues Report

A revised draft (based in comments received) is now posted on the wiki pointed to from the agenda of our Oct 14 meeting.

Alan

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