French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_ French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading. Critics of the catch-all "Bill on direction and planning for the performance of domestic security" say that filtering won't stop the spread of child pornography -- but could allow the government to censor other materials. The bill, known as Loppsi II in French, was approved by 312 votes to 214 in a vote in the National Assembly on Tuesday. The government has a large majority in the Assembly; two of its deputies abstained, with the others all voting in favor of the bill. The Senate, where the government also has a majority, will soon give the bill a second reading. If the Senate makes no amendments to the text, that will also be its final reading, as the government has declared the bill "urgent," a procedural move that reduces the usual cycle of four readings to two. Any disagreements between the two parliamentary chambers will be reconciled by a commission appointed by the government. Full article available at http://www.pcworld.com/article/189542/french_net_filtering_plan_moves_forwar... Rudi Vansnick President Internet Society Belgium vzw Voorzitter TIK vzw Board member EURALO (ALAC - ICANN) ccNSO liaison
Le 18/02/2010 15:56, Rudi Vansnick a écrit :
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading.
I had lunch with a chap from CISCO France last week and we discussed this. Apparently, 1. the cost of installing the powerful equipment required to perform content filtering of all traffic is so prohibitive that there are real questions in the industry about who will pay for it. 2. zip your file and encrypt it using a *free* zip/encryptor and the file cannot be detected/decrypted In other words, it's another law promoted by clueless non-technical "advisors", designed to make headlines, but with no substance, completely un-enforceable, but which procured some work for a group of people whom would have been unemployed otherwise. But then, this is France, we've got quantities of laws like that which are never enforced... :-) -- Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD http://www.gih.com/ocl.html
On 02/18/2010 08:37 AM, Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond wrote:
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic...
I had lunch with a chap from CISCO France last week and we discussed this. Apparently, 1. the cost of installing the powerful equipment required to perform content filtering of all traffic is so prohibitive ...
Once upon a time, when sorting some data, I learned that in computers there is often an efficient way and an inefficient (in my case a very, very inefficient) way to do it, especially if some of the constraints (such as 100% complete filtering) can be slightly relaxed. Some filter people think that they need to reassemble entire TCP streams and scan the data, all in the real-time packet forwarding path of a router or switch. That's an inefficient way. And it requires mongo amounts of horsepower. One easier way is to use a lesser device that hangs off the span port on a switch that mainly inspects and occasionally injects a TCP RESET. Another better way is to merely look at the first packet after the TCP connection establishment three-way handshake. For HTTP (web) traffic that packet quite often tells you everything you really care about when you are deciding whether to block that TCP connection or not. And this looking at the data can occur slightly outside of the real-time packet forwarding path of the inspection device: Because TCP connections typically last at least a 100 milliseconds, there's plenty of time to inject a TCP RESET or to block the latter data or ACK packets and thus usually vitiate the usefulness even of the data that was successfully transfered on the earlier part of the TCP connection. (An amusing sidelight: Because the TCP RESET approach is so easy, and was used by Comcast in the US, some smart users installed filters on their PC's to block TCP RESETS and thus nullified the effect of the provider content filters.) These "better" ways still requires some heavy duty gear, but we're talking more like a beefy PC dangling off the span port of a switch, rather than a Cisco carrier grade router. Sure, this "better" way will miss a few. But on today's web a typical web page requires several dozen, and often many more, subsidiary web fetches to tracking images, javascript loads, little graphics, etc etc. And blocking even one of those, even if the main page load has occurred, causes the page to render inaccurately (or not at all) and can have nearly the same negative impact as blocking the main page.
2. zip your file and encrypt it using a *free* zip/encryptor and the file cannot be detected/decrypted
That works great - until encrypted data is presumed by the censor to contain bad stuff and thus must be included among the things to be blocked. As they say in the song "paranoia strikes deep".
In other words, it's another law promoted by clueless non-technical "advisors"
Ah, the clueless may be ineffective in achieving their intended purpose, but along the way they are often very effective in creating collateral damage.
... this is France, we've got quantities of laws like that which are never enforced... :-)
California has the same problem. For example, we've got a McCarthy era (early 1950's "red scare") law on the books under which entities such as ICANN are labeled as a "subversive" organization. Unfortunately such laws, even if not routinely enforced today, are like some lost unexploded WW-I shell buried in a farmer's field that could be dug up and cause damage in the future. --karl--
On 02/18/2010 08:37 AM, Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond wrote:
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic...
I had lunch with a chap from CISCO France last week and we discussed this. Apparently, 1. the cost of installing the powerful equipment required to perform content filtering of all traffic is so prohibitive ... They may not mean content filtering of traffic, per se. Many people equate content filters with web filters, such as cyber patrol, net nanny, and the like. For those who don't know, these products block sites that have been determined to have certain types of content, ie. porn.
In other words, it's another law promoted by clueless non-technical "advisors"
Ah, the clueless may be ineffective in achieving their intended purpose, but along the way they are often very effective in creating collateral damage.
I testified in the Texas Senate in 2001 on the issue of internet filtering. They were pushing a bill that would require all computers sold in or from texas to include an internet filter. It would only cost a dollar to include a disk, so there would not be any harm. This bill was introduced by a senator who saw a porn popup from his aol e-mail account, while the aol child protection filter was turned on.
You have just to watch your best new film in any streaming platform and you are out of this useless law. I am not even sure that we need "advisors" to make a filtering law. Societal and economic principles has changed in the virtual world and any law will be based on "old" principals will be useless.
2. zip your file and encrypt it using a *free* zip/encryptor and the file cannot be detected/decrypted
This works if you have the possibility to encrypt something in your country :) In France may be but not elsewhere.
In other words, it's another law promoted by clueless non-technical "advisors", designed to make headlines, but with no substance, completely un-enforceable, but which procured some work for a group of people whom would have been unemployed otherwise. But then, this is France, we've got quantities of laws like that which are never enforced... :-)
I was interested in reading comments on the French Filtering law, but by a French ALS. You guess why .... Anyway that law concerns the general organization of Police. There is two articles (2 and 26) that concern the Internet. 2 is IMHO more interesting by the way jurisprudence may develop for political or deffamatory spam. Article 26 looks so stupid that even a journalist might understand there are far better reasons than the one he gives. The interest here will be in looking at the way that legal article will be used and the jurisprudence that may develop. In any case I would be surprised if Cisco ever heard of it. I would rather suggest to look at RFIDs and nanocoms. jfc
Hi Rudi I am quite afraid of these "protections" . I never believe in the innocence of these controls. Once they are there, anything can be done! Vanda Scartezini NEXTi_v1.jpg an ICANN ALS tel: + 55 11 3266.6253 mob:+ 55 11 8181.1464 www.executivasdeti.blogspot.com -----Original Message----- From: at-large-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:at-large-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Rudi Vansnick Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2010 12:56 PM To: At-Large Worldwide Subject: [At-Large] French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward _*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_ French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading. Critics of the catch-all "Bill on direction and planning for the performance of domestic security" say that filtering won't stop the spread of child pornography -- but could allow the government to censor other materials. The bill, known as Loppsi II in French, was approved by 312 votes to 214 in a vote in the National Assembly on Tuesday. The government has a large majority in the Assembly; two of its deputies abstained, with the others all voting in favor of the bill. The Senate, where the government also has a majority, will soon give the bill a second reading. If the Senate makes no amendments to the text, that will also be its final reading, as the government has declared the bill "urgent," a procedural move that reduces the usual cycle of four readings to two. Any disagreements between the two parliamentary chambers will be reconciled by a commission appointed by the government. Full article available at http://www.pcworld.com/article/189542/french_net_filtering_plan_moves_forwar d.html?tk=rss_news Rudi Vansnick President Internet Society Belgium vzw Voorzitter TIK vzw Board member EURALO (ALAC - ICANN) ccNSO liaison _______________________________________________ At-Large mailing list At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org http://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large_atlarge-lists.icann .org At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org
When it comes to these matters, I am an absolutist, meaning I am the only one qualified to determine what I shall see/not see or read/not read and so I am absolutely against censorship in all its forms. Child pornography is a scourge, no question. But parents need to do what parents ought to do. So do schools. I simply cannot abide someone else determining such a basic part of my being. And I am unanimous on that. Carlton Samuels ================================================================================ On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Rudi Vansnick <rudi.vansnick@isoc.be>wrote:
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading.
Critics of the catch-all "Bill on direction and planning for the performance of domestic security" say that filtering won't stop the spread of child pornography -- but could allow the government to censor other materials.
The bill, known as Loppsi II in French, was approved by 312 votes to 214 in a vote in the National Assembly on Tuesday. The government has a large majority in the Assembly; two of its deputies abstained, with the others all voting in favor of the bill.
The Senate, where the government also has a majority, will soon give the bill a second reading. If the Senate makes no amendments to the text, that will also be its final reading, as the government has declared the bill "urgent," a procedural move that reduces the usual cycle of four readings to two. Any disagreements between the two parliamentary chambers will be reconciled by a commission appointed by the government.
Full article available at http://www.pcworld.com/article/189542/french_net_filtering_plan_moves_forwar...
Rudi Vansnick President Internet Society Belgium vzw Voorzitter TIK vzw Board member EURALO (ALAC - ICANN) ccNSO liaison
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-- +========+++++++++++++++====== Carlton A Samuels Strategies for Education Technologies and Curriculum Development, ICT Policy, Internet Governance and Process Improvement
Very well put, Carlton. We need to be very vocal in protecting our Internet freedoms. Gareth On 18-Feb-10, at 1:14 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:
When it comes to these matters, I am an absolutist, meaning I am the only one qualified to determine what I shall see/not see or read/not read and so I am absolutely against censorship in all its forms.
Child pornography is a scourge, no question. But parents need to do what parents ought to do. So do schools. I simply cannot abide someone else determining such a basic part of my being.
And I am unanimous on that.
Carlton Samuels = = = = = = = = = = ======================================================================
On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Rudi Vansnick <rudi.vansnick@isoc.be>wrote:
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading.
Critics of the catch-all "Bill on direction and planning for the performance of domestic security" say that filtering won't stop the spread of child pornography -- but could allow the government to censor other materials.
The bill, known as Loppsi II in French, was approved by 312 votes to 214 in a vote in the National Assembly on Tuesday. The government has a large majority in the Assembly; two of its deputies abstained, with the others all voting in favor of the bill.
The Senate, where the government also has a majority, will soon give the bill a second reading. If the Senate makes no amendments to the text, that will also be its final reading, as the government has declared the bill "urgent," a procedural move that reduces the usual cycle of four readings to two. Any disagreements between the two parliamentary chambers will be reconciled by a commission appointed by the government.
Full article available at http://www.pcworld.com/article/189542/french_net_filtering_plan_moves_forwar...
Rudi Vansnick President Internet Society Belgium vzw Voorzitter TIK vzw Board member EURALO (ALAC - ICANN) ccNSO liaison
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-- +========+++++++++++++++====== Carlton A Samuels Strategies for Education Technologies and Curriculum Development, ICT Policy, Internet Governance and Process Improvement _______________________________________________ At-Large mailing list At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org http://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large_atlarge-lists.icann...
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On 18 February 2010 16:14, Carlton Samuels <carlton.samuels@gmail.com>wrote:
When it comes to these matters, I am an absolutist, meaning I am the only one qualified to determine what I shall see/not see or read/not read and so I am absolutely against censorship in all its forms.
Child pornography is a scourge, no question. But parents need to do what parents ought to do. So do schools. I simply cannot abide someone else determining such a basic part of my being.
And I am unanimous on that.
Agreed. Further, it has been my experience that the invoking of child safety is almost always the cause for warning bells, in advance of ill-advised and generally useless regulation that (in fact deliberately) targets adults wanting to be left alone. How different is the French initiative from the Australian one? - Evan
Well said, Carlton - I totally agree! Jacqueline Carlton Samuels wrote:
When it comes to these matters, I am an absolutist, meaning I am the only one qualified to determine what I shall see/not see or read/not read and so I am absolutely against censorship in all its forms.
Child pornography is a scourge, no question. But parents need to do what parents ought to do. So do schools. I simply cannot abide someone else determining such a basic part of my being.
And I am unanimous on that.
Carlton Samuels ================================================================================
On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Rudi Vansnick <rudi.vansnick@isoc.be>wrote:
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading.
Critics of the catch-all "Bill on direction and planning for the performance of domestic security" say that filtering won't stop the spread of child pornography -- but could allow the government to censor other materials.
The bill, known as Loppsi II in French, was approved by 312 votes to 214 in a vote in the National Assembly on Tuesday. The government has a large majority in the Assembly; two of its deputies abstained, with the others all voting in favor of the bill.
The Senate, where the government also has a majority, will soon give the bill a second reading. If the Senate makes no amendments to the text, that will also be its final reading, as the government has declared the bill "urgent," a procedural move that reduces the usual cycle of four readings to two. Any disagreements between the two parliamentary chambers will be reconciled by a commission appointed by the government.
Full article available at http://www.pcworld.com/article/189542/french_net_filtering_plan_moves_forwar...
Rudi Vansnick President Internet Society Belgium vzw Voorzitter TIK vzw Board member EURALO (ALAC - ICANN) ccNSO liaison
_______________________________________________ At-Large mailing list At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org
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At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org
Like always, I agree totally with you my friend. Carlos Dionisio Aguirre abogado - Sarmiento 71 - 4to. 18 Cordoba - Argentina - *54-351-424-2123 / 423-5423 www.derechoytecnologia.com.ar http://ar.ageiadensi.org
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 16:14:54 -0500 From: carlton.samuels@gmail.com To: at-large@atlarge-lists.icann.org Subject: Re: [At-Large] French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward
When it comes to these matters, I am an absolutist, meaning I am the only one qualified to determine what I shall see/not see or read/not read and so I am absolutely against censorship in all its forms.
Child pornography is a scourge, no question. But parents need to do what parents ought to do. So do schools. I simply cannot abide someone else determining such a basic part of my being.
And I am unanimous on that.
Carlton Samuels ================================================================================
On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Rudi Vansnick <rudi.vansnick@isoc.be>wrote:
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_
French lawmakers voted Tuesday to approve a draft law to filter Internet traffic, a measure the government says is intended to catch child pornographers. The bill will now go on for a second and final reading.
Critics of the catch-all "Bill on direction and planning for the performance of domestic security" say that filtering won't stop the spread of child pornography -- but could allow the government to censor other materials.
The bill, known as Loppsi II in French, was approved by 312 votes to 214 in a vote in the National Assembly on Tuesday. The government has a large majority in the Assembly; two of its deputies abstained, with the others all voting in favor of the bill.
The Senate, where the government also has a majority, will soon give the bill a second reading. If the Senate makes no amendments to the text, that will also be its final reading, as the government has declared the bill "urgent," a procedural move that reduces the usual cycle of four readings to two. Any disagreements between the two parliamentary chambers will be reconciled by a commission appointed by the government.
Full article available at http://www.pcworld.com/article/189542/french_net_filtering_plan_moves_forwar...
Rudi Vansnick President Internet Society Belgium vzw Voorzitter TIK vzw Board member EURALO (ALAC - ICANN) ccNSO liaison
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-- +========+++++++++++++++====== Carlton A Samuels Strategies for Education Technologies and Curriculum Development, ICT Policy, Internet Governance and Process Improvement _______________________________________________ At-Large mailing list At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org http://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large_atlarge-lists.icann...
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* Rudi Vansnick wrote:
_*French Net Filtering Plan Moves Forward*_
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participants (13)
-
Bill Silverstein -
carlos aguirre -
Carlton Samuels -
Evan Leibovitch -
Gareth Shearman -
Jacqueline A. Morris -
JFC Morfin -
Karl Auerbach -
Khaled KOUBAA -
Lutz Donnerhacke -
Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond -
Rudi Vansnick -
Vanda UOL