Hallo Brian, I would like to re-visit an old proposal on getting more public participation and interest in the draft final report we have circulated for public comments. We had considered having a webinar before teh ICANN Meeting on the proposed recommendations so that folks coming to Buenos Aires can begin thinking about the proposed recommendations. I don't know if we shall still be able to have this webinar and if the team would able to put in about half hour to an hour to discuss with the community members interested on the draft document already in the public domain. Secondly, will we work again like we did in Bejing and Durban meeting individual and or groups or focus on the public forum? Kind regards Fiona Asonga
Not sure if Brian is around or not, but I can answer most of this. The Chair and VCs had an extensive discussion on the issue of a webinar. Even though such webinars are typically poorly attended, several of us thought that it would be a good idea, but just not practical given the short time available to do it (and implicit short warning for participants). It is another of the results of our compressed time-frame. There will not be an open public meeting in BA (which have been so poorly attended in the past) but we will be meeting individually with pretty much all SGs. The currently planned schedule is at https://community.icann.org/display/ATRT2/Buenos+Aires+-+18-20+November+2013. Alan At 25/10/2013 09:49 AM, Fiona Asonga wrote:
Hallo Brian,
I would like to re-visit an old proposal on getting more public participation and interest in the draft final report we have circulated for public comments. We had considered having a webinar before teh ICANN Meeting on the proposed recommendations so that folks coming to Buenos Aires can begin thinking about the proposed recommendations. I don't know if we shall still be able to have this webinar and if the team would able to put in about half hour to an hour to discuss with the community members interested on the draft document already in the public domain.
Secondly, will we work again like we did in Bejing and Durban meeting individual and or groups or focus on the public forum?
Kind regards
Fiona Asonga _______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
Fiona, That was the conclusion we reached after lengthy discussion with ICANN Staff. I am open to ways we can get the Community's attention to the Report and get input, the webinar just did not present itself as good return for time and energy spent. Best, Brian On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca>wrote:
Not sure if Brian is around or not, but I can answer most of this.
The Chair and VCs had an extensive discussion on the issue of a webinar. Even though such webinars are typically poorly attended, several of us thought that it would be a good idea, but just not practical given the short time available to do it (and implicit short warning for participants). It is another of the results of our compressed time-frame.
There will not be an open public meeting in BA (which have been so poorly attended in the past) but we will be meeting individually with pretty much all SGs. The currently planned schedule is at https://community.icann.org/ **display/ATRT2/Buenos+Aires+-+**18-20+November+2013<https://community.icann.org/display/ATRT2/Buenos+Aires+-+18-20+November+2013> .
Alan
At 25/10/2013 09:49 AM, Fiona Asonga wrote:
Hallo Brian,
I would like to re-visit an old proposal on getting more public participation and interest in the draft final report we have circulated for public comments. We had considered having a webinar before teh ICANN Meeting on the proposed recommendations so that folks coming to Buenos Aires can begin thinking about the proposed recommendations. I don't know if we shall still be able to have this webinar and if the team would able to put in about half hour to an hour to discuss with the community members interested on the draft document already in the public domain.
Secondly, will we work again like we did in Bejing and Durban meeting individual and or groups or focus on the public forum?
Kind regards
Fiona Asonga ______________________________**_________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/**listinfo/atrt2<https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2>
______________________________**_________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/**listinfo/atrt2<https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2>
Hi, Was it a matter of cost to not have the webinar? I apologize that I was not able to be at the meeting that discussed this, but I was traveling. In any case, I would assume any decision we make as chair/v-chair is something that the rest of the ATRT gets to overrule. So perhaps I loss my vote by not having been at a meeting I should have been at, but if others thinks we need to more, perhaps we need to consider it. Also I think it may be a mistake to not have a public session at BA. Might give the appearance that we are hiding. While it is good to get a good size crowd of participants, it is important to be accessible to the community as part of our own accountability - we have to be available to the flight of incoming tomatoes even if one a few people come to talk. I have been at the IGF2013 which just ended, and some of us made a big deal of the AOC mechanisms, to not be visible to a new participant who may drift to our meeting based on ICANN's very visible presence in Bali might not be the best option. but you may be right, no one may come - I just don't think that is the point. One problem with only meeting with the SO/AC is that it misses the large part of population who are not part of of these organizations, including any newcomers there may be. just saying, avri On 26 Oct 2013, at 00:56, Brian Cute wrote:
Fiona,
That was the conclusion we reached after lengthy discussion with ICANN Staff. I am open to ways we can get the Community's attention to the Report and get input, the webinar just did not present itself as good return for time and energy spent.
Best, Brian
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca> wrote: Not sure if Brian is around or not, but I can answer most of this.
The Chair and VCs had an extensive discussion on the issue of a webinar. Even though such webinars are typically poorly attended, several of us thought that it would be a good idea, but just not practical given the short time available to do it (and implicit short warning for participants). It is another of the results of our compressed time-frame.
There will not be an open public meeting in BA (which have been so poorly attended in the past) but we will be meeting individually with pretty much all SGs. The currently planned schedule is at https://community.icann.org/display/ATRT2/Buenos+Aires+-+18-20+November+2013.
Alan
At 25/10/2013 09:49 AM, Fiona Asonga wrote: Hallo Brian,
I would like to re-visit an old proposal on getting more public participation and interest in the draft final report we have circulated for public comments. We had considered having a webinar before teh ICANN Meeting on the proposed recommendations so that folks coming to Buenos Aires can begin thinking about the proposed recommendations. I don't know if we shall still be able to have this webinar and if the team would able to put in about half hour to an hour to discuss with the community members interested on the draft document already in the public domain.
Secondly, will we work again like we did in Bejing and Durban meeting individual and or groups or focus on the public forum?
Kind regards
Fiona Asonga _______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
_______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
_______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
It had nothing to do with cost. See my earlier reply. It was just a matter of bandwidth to organize a presentation, lack of time to adequately publicize and hold it prior to BA, and history of poor turnouts. I personally supported a webinar, but there was little other interest and I was not in a position to take it on myself. Regarding a public meeting, I tend to agree. If I recall correctly, at least part of the problem was the lack of time given that we committed to ATRT people being there for such a few number of days, coupled with the very tight scheduling given the 4-day week and our decision to seclude ourselves on Monday. Alan At 25/10/2013 08:50 PM, Avri Doria wrote:
Hi,
Was it a matter of cost to not have the webinar?
I apologize that I was not able to be at the meeting that discussed this, but I was traveling. In any case, I would assume any decision we make as chair/v-chair is something that the rest of the ATRT gets to overrule. So perhaps I loss my vote by not having been at a meeting I should have been at, but if others thinks we need to more, perhaps we need to consider it.
Also I think it may be a mistake to not have a public session at BA. Might give the appearance that we are hiding.
While it is good to get a good size crowd of participants, it is important to be accessible to the community as part of our own accountability - we have to be available to the flight of incoming tomatoes even if one a few people come to talk. I have been at the IGF2013 which just ended, and some of us made a big deal of the AOC mechanisms, to not be visible to a new participant who may drift to our meeting based on ICANN's very visible presence in Bali might not be the best option. but you may be right, no one may come - I just don't think that is the point.
One problem with only meeting with the SO/AC is that it misses the large part of population who are not part of of these organizations, including any newcomers there may be.
just saying,
avri
On 26 Oct 2013, at 00:56, Brian Cute wrote:
Fiona,
That was the conclusion we reached after lengthy discussion with ICANN Staff. I am open to ways we can get the Community's attention to the Report and get input, the webinar just did not present itself as good return for time and energy spent.
Best, Brian
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca> wrote: Not sure if Brian is around or not, but I can answer most of this.
The Chair and VCs had an extensive discussion on the issue of a webinar. Even though such webinars are typically poorly attended, several of us thought that it would be a good idea, but just not practical given the short time available to do it (and implicit short warning for participants). It is another of the results of our compressed time-frame.
There will not be an open public meeting in BA (which have been so poorly attended in the past) but we will be meeting individually with pretty much all SGs. The currently planned schedule is at https://community.icann.org/display/ATRT2/Buenos+Aires+-+18-20+November+2013.
Alan
At 25/10/2013 09:49 AM, Fiona Asonga wrote: Hallo Brian,
I would like to re-visit an old proposal on getting more public participation and interest in the draft final report we have circulated for public comments. We had considered having a webinar before teh ICANN Meeting on the proposed recommendations so that folks coming to Buenos Aires can begin thinking about the proposed recommendations. I don't know if we shall still be able to have this webinar and if the team would able to put in about half hour to an hour to discuss with the community members interested on the draft document already in the public domain.
Secondly, will we work again like we did in Bejing and Durban meeting individual and or groups or focus on the public forum?
Kind regards
Fiona Asonga _______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
_______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
_______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
_______________________________________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/atrt2
Avri, On Oct 25, 2013, at 8:50 PM, Avri Doria <avri@acm.org> wrote:
So perhaps I loss my vote by not having been at a meeting I should have been at, but if others thinks we need to more, perhaps we need to consider it.
I personally don't think it is worth the time/resources/effort. I think it far more valuable to spend the time talking to individual constituencies, SOs, ACs, etc. However, with that said, as a future consideration, we might want to recommending to the next ATRT that they might consider having "office hours" or similar (maybe sharing space with the ombudsman?) at ICANN meetings, where individuals can come to raise issues/ask questions.
Also I think it may be a mistake to not have a public session at BA. Might give the appearance that we are hiding.
Given the participation at previous public sessions, I disagree -- I suspect the appearance would be more of wasting non-trivial resources.
While it is good to get a good size crowd of participants, it is important to be accessible to the community as part of our own accountability - we have to be available to the flight of incoming tomatoes even if one a few people come to talk.
I think we've been pretty open that individual members can be approached at any time. I don't think a public session in which transcripts are taken and multiple translations provided in a large (almost certainly) empty auditorium is the best venue in which people will come "to talk" which, in the context of ATRT, is usually to raise issues that some consider sensitive or controversial. I believe we'll get far more tomatoes (and cupcakes ... or whatever the positive opposite of tomatoes would be) in the constituency/SO/AC sessions or in individual one-on-one sessions.
One problem with only meeting with the SO/AC is that it misses the large part of population who are not part of of these organizations, including any newcomers there may be.
And newcomers who don't participate in any SO/AC are going to feel comfortable commenting on ATRT recommendations? Regards, -drc
On 26 Oct 2013, at 12:01, David Conrad wrote:
However, with that said, as a future consideration, we might want to recommending to the next ATRT that they might consider having "office hours" or similar (maybe sharing space with the ombudsman?) at ICANN meetings, where individuals can come to raise issues/ask questions.
i thought of office hours and was almost going to recommend it for this time. maybe we should consider it.
Also I think it may be a mistake to not have a public session at BA. Might give the appearance that we are hiding.
Given the participation at previous public sessions, I disagree -- I suspect the appearance would be more of wasting non-trivial resources.
Which resources? Our time? We are really there in BA predominantly to make sure we have been proactively receptive all that anyone might have to say. ICANN room allocation? Staff Time? As far as I am concerned, in many ways, nothing happening at ICANN is more important than the ATRT as everything we do rest on a very narrow edge of our legitimacy - which i not as secure as people in ICANN may thing, especially these days.
One problem with only meeting with the SO/AC is that it misses the large part of population who are not part of of these organizations, including any newcomers there may be.
And newcomers who don't participate in any SO/AC are going to feel comfortable commenting on ATRT recommendations?
And yet we are asked about the acceptance from outside the ICANN bubble. And at IGF, a much larger and wilder bubble, we did tell people to read it and get back to us - with invitations to show up at an ICANN meeting if they could. But of course, if I find myself alone in this impression (indeed I have no facts to base my feelings on - it is only after we receive the first complaint that I will have facts), this is not one of the things I am going to insist on. I just think it is the right thing to do. avri
Thanks Brian Much appreciated. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Cute" <brianacute@gmail.com> To: "Alan Greenberg" <alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca> Cc: "Fiona Asonga" <fasonga@kixp.or.ke>, "Brian Cute" <bcute@pir.org>, "ATRT2" <atrt2@icann.org> Sent: Friday, October 25, 2013 7:56:56 PM Subject: Re: [atrt2] Preparation for Buenos Aires Fiona, That was the conclusion we reached after lengthy discussion with ICANN Staff. I am open to ways we can get the Community's attention to the Report and get input, the webinar just did not present itself as good return for time and energy spent. Best, Brian On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Alan Greenberg < alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca > wrote: Not sure if Brian is around or not, but I can answer most of this. The Chair and VCs had an extensive discussion on the issue of a webinar. Even though such webinars are typically poorly attended, several of us thought that it would be a good idea, but just not practical given the short time available to do it (and implicit short warning for participants). It is another of the results of our compressed time-frame. There will not be an open public meeting in BA (which have been so poorly attended in the past) but we will be meeting individually with pretty much all SGs. The currently planned schedule is at https://community.icann.org/ display/ATRT2/Buenos+Aires+-+ 18-20+November+2013 . Alan At 25/10/2013 09:49 AM, Fiona Asonga wrote: Hallo Brian, I would like to re-visit an old proposal on getting more public participation and interest in the draft final report we have circulated for public comments. We had considered having a webinar before teh ICANN Meeting on the proposed recommendations so that folks coming to Buenos Aires can begin thinking about the proposed recommendations. I don't know if we shall still be able to have this webinar and if the team would able to put in about half hour to an hour to discuss with the community members interested on the draft document already in the public domain. Secondly, will we work again like we did in Bejing and Durban meeting individual and or groups or focus on the public forum? Kind regards Fiona Asonga ______________________________ _________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/ listinfo/atrt2 ______________________________ _________________ atrt2 mailing list atrt2@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/ listinfo/atrt2
participants (5)
-
Alan Greenberg -
Avri Doria -
Brian Cute -
David Conrad -
Fiona Asonga