James,
thanks for this clear and concise explanation. I agree with your assessment on
process.
I
would like to raise a question about the “No Support” for Recommendation 11 in
our draft communication. I understand there is opposition to the 2/3 threshold
increase, but Recommendation 11 is broader than that…it also incorporates the
threshold definition of GAC consensus advice (no formal opposition) into the
bylaws, which is something very positive for all of us in the GNSO. Do we really
want to signal “no support” for the entire recommendation, or should we perhaps
make it “limited support with some opposition?” I’m a bit concerned that
we’d be sending an inaccurate signal to the CCWG if it was left as simply “no
support.”
For
the record, the RySG understands that Recommendation 11 is a package and we
suggested new provisions if the 2/3 language were to remain. We would be happy
to see the 2/3 threshold reversed, but we did not signal “no support” on Rec-11
in our written comments to the CCWG.
Happy
to discuss further on the upcoming Council call.
Regards,
Keith
From:
owner-council@gnso.icann.org [mailto:owner-council@gnso.icann.org] On Behalf
Of James M. Bladel
Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2016 2:54
PM
To: egmorris1@toast.net; Johan Helsingius; Amr Elsadr; Marika
Konings
Cc: WUKnoben; GNSO Council List
Subject: Re:
[council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third Draft
Report
Colleagues:
The
discussion around this has been extremely valuable, and big thanks for all of
those who weighed in. I apologize for taking so long to weigh in, but I
was watching some of the keynote speeches here at NamesCon (include
Paul’s. Nice job!). In any event, my thoughts are
below.
What
is the purpose of tomorrow’s call?
The
GNSO Council will send its unified position on the CCWG-Accountability
recommendations to the co-chairs of the CCWG. We will achieve this by
reviewing, discussing and approving the Consolidated document that was prepared
by the SubTeam.
Should
we do this now, or wait for the final CCWG Recommendations?
It
seems increasingly likely that there will be a new set of modified CCWG
Recommendations in the near future. However, if we want to help shape the
next report to ensure it reflects the views of the GNSO Community, we need to
comment on this set of Recommendations now. Doing so will also provide
guidance & support to the GNSO members of the CCWG-ACCT in their work to
drive the best outcomes.
Are
we voting, or drafting a letter, or what?
This
is an open question for tomorrow’s call. Some have indicated a preference
for a less formal (letter) response, similar to what we’ve seen from the
ccNSO. Others have noted that something this important would benefit from
an itemized expression of support/non-support. The CCWG co-chairs, and the
CCWG charter, appear to favor the latter, and certainly a formal vote will be
required for the Final Recommendations. My hope is that we are able to
resolve this tomorrow, but if necessary we can vote on whether or not we need to
vote (!).
If
we do vote, then what is the vote about? What are we voting on? How will this go
down?
If
we proceed with a vote, then the Councilors will be asked whether or not they
agree with the Subteam’s analysis & consolidation of the public comments
filed by the SGs and CS. In other words, we will be voting on the
—language— of the response, NOT the response itself. Example: If the
Subteam reports that the GNSO opposes a recommendation, a “Yes” vote will agree
with that statement of GNSO opposition, not the recommendation itself.
Hopefully this will become clearer tomorrow as we walk through the
document.
What
if we can’t agree?
If
we cannot reach consensus (either via discussion or voting) on the GNSO response
to any recommendation, then we will refer the CCWG Co-Chairs back to the
individual comments filed by the SGs and Cs. I believe there are a few
(2-3) areas in the report where this may be the case. But generally
speaking, the Subteam found a great deal of overlap in SG/C positions, and when
those comments included qualifiers or conditions, those were usually not in
conflict.
From:
<owner-council@gnso.icann.org>
on behalf of Edward Morris <egmorris1@toast.net>
Reply-To:
"egmorris1@toast.net" <egmorris1@toast.net>
Date:
Wednesday, January 13, 2016 at 8:40
To: Johan Helsingius <julf@julf.com>, Amr Elsadr <aelsadr@egyptig.org>, Marika Konings
<marika.konings@icann.org>
Cc:
WUKnoben <wolf-ulrich.knoben@t-online.de>,
GNSO Council List <council@gnso.icann.org>
Subject:
Re: [council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third
Draft Report
Hi
Marika,
I'm very
appreciative of your efforts to make us aware of the approach the CCNSO took. We
need all the input we can get. Now if you could do the same for the GAC I think
we all would be double appreciative! (we're still waiting for some smoke signals
from our government colleagues).
I'm
sorry if I wasn't clear. I definitely think we should be taking an up and down
vote on each of the recommendations. I referenced the sub-teams work only to
suggest that format - response by recommendation - be used going forward. Thanks
for letting me know that I wasn't clear and giving me the chance to clear up any
misunderstanding.
Ed
From:
"Marika Konings" <marika.konings@icann.org>
Sent:
Wednesday, January 13, 2016 4:27 PM
To: "Edward Morris" <egmorris1@toast.net>, "Johan
Helsingius" <julf@julf.com>, "Amr
Elsadr" <aelsadr@egyptig.org>
Cc:
"WUKnoben" <wolf-ulrich.knoben@t-online.de>,
"GNSO Council List" <council@gnso.icann.org>
Subject:
Re: [council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third
Draft Report
Thanks,
Ed. I didn’t mean to imply that the ccNSO response was the way to go, I thought
it just might be of interest to see how other chartering organisations in
addition to the ALAC approached it.
As a
point of clarification, are you suggesting that an up / down vote would be taken
on the response provided by the sub-team, not necessarily the recommendations
themselves? I thought you were suggesting the latter in your initial email, but
your last paragraph in this section makes me think you are suggesting the
former?
Best
regards,
Marika
From:
<owner-council@gnso.icann.org>
on behalf of Edward Morris <egmorris1@toast.net>
Reply-To:
Edward Morris <egmorris1@toast.net>
Date:
Wednesday 13 January 2016 at 17:16
To: Johan Helsingius <julf@julf.com>, Amr Elsadr <aelsadr@egyptig.org>, Marika Konings
<marika.konings@icann.org>
Cc:
WUKnoben <wolf-ulrich.knoben@t-online.de>,
GNSO Council List <council@gnso.icann.org>
Subject:
Re: [council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third
Draft Report
Hi
Marika,
Thanks
for this. That certainly is an approach we could take but I question it's
overall utility to those of us in the CCWG who are attempting to put together a
proposal all of the chartering organisations can
support.
I would
refer everyone to the CCWG Charter ( ),
specifically:
---
SO and
AC support for the Draft Proposal(s)
Following submission of the Draft
Proposal(s), each of the chartering organizations shall, in accordance with
their own rules and procedures, review and discuss the Draft Proposal(s) and
decide whether to adopt the recommendations contained in it. The chairs of the
chartering organizations shall notify the co-chairs of the WG of the result of
the deliberations as soon as feasible.
Supplemental Draft
Proposal
In the event that one or more of the participating SO’s or AC’s
do(es) not adopt one or more of the recommendation(s) contained in the Draft
Proposal(s), the Co-Chairs of the CCWG-Accountability shall be notified
accordingly. This notification shall include at a minimum the reasons for the
lack of support and a suggested alternative that would be acceptable, if any.
The CCWG-Accountability may, at its discretion, reconsider, post for public
comments and/or submit to the chartering organizations a Supplemental Draft
Proposal, which takes into accounting the concerns
raised.
Following submission of the Supplemental Draft Proposal,
the chartering organizations shall discuss and decide in accordance with its own
rules and procedures whether to adopt the recommendations contained in the
Supplemental Draft Proposal. The Chairs of the chartering organizations shall
notify the Co-Chairs of the CCWG-Accountability of the result of the
deliberations as soon as feasible.
---
With the
exception of its referral to the CWG requirements, I don't find the CCNSO
response to be particularly helpful. Provisional support of the "direction of
travel" doesn't tell the CCWG if we need to change some specifics of any of our
recommendations. If the CCNSO is prepared to support all the recommendations
save those related to the CWG they should say so. What we're trying to avoid is
a situation where only on the final vote of approval / disapproval do we become
aware of a Chartering organisations problems with a specific recommendation. As
I understand things, that actually is the purpose of the special attention being
paid to the Chartering organisations in this round of public comments. Although
there are some tweaks that probably should be made, I do largely support
the work of the Council sub-team and the result of their efforts and hope that
is the basis of our discussion and response.
Best,
Ed
From:
"Marika Konings" <marika.konings@icann.org>
Sent:
Wednesday, January 13, 2016 3:39 PM
To: "Edward Morris" <egmorris1@toast.net>, "Johan
Helsingius" <julf@julf.com>, "Amr
Elsadr" <aelsadr@egyptig.org>
Cc:
"WUKnoben" <wolf-ulrich.knoben@t-online.de>,
"GNSO Council List" <council@gnso.icann.org>
Subject:
Re: [council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third
Draft Report
You may
also be interested to see the approach the ccNSO Council took in their comments
on the third draft proposal: http://ccnso.icann.org/workinggroups/ccwg-draft-3-proposal-07jan16-en.pdf.
Best
regards,
Marika
From:
<owner-council@gnso.icann.org>
on behalf of Edward Morris <egmorris1@toast.net>
Reply-To:
Edward Morris <egmorris1@toast.net>
Date:
Wednesday 13 January 2016 at 15:42
To: Johan Helsingius <julf@julf.com>, Amr Elsadr <aelsadr@egyptig.org>
Cc:
WUKnoben <wolf-ulrich.knoben@t-online.de>,
GNSO Council List <council@gnso.icann.org>
Subject:
Re: [council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third
Draft Report
Hi,
Other
chartering organisations (see, for example, ALAC: http://forum.icann.org/lists/comments-draft-ccwg-accountability-proposal-30nov15/pdfeO5FTDW5b5.pdf
) have given clear indications of approval / disapproval of each of the twelve
recommendations, along with reasoning thereof. I'd suggest we do the same. I'm
ambivalent as to whether we indicate our preferences in the form of a Motion or
a letter from our Chair, but I do believe the CCWG needs the simplified
guidance that only a straight up / down decision on each recommendation can
give.
Ed
From: "Amr
Elsadr" <aelsadr@egyptig.org>
Sent:
Wednesday, January 13, 2016 2:07 PM
To: "Johan Helsingius" <julf@julf.com>
Cc: "WUKnoben"
<wolf-ulrich.knoben@t-online.de>,
"GNSO Council List" <council@gnso.icann.org>
Subject:
Re: [council] Motion for GNSO Consideration of the CCWG Accountability Third
Draft Report
Hi,
I
agree that a formal vote is not absolutely needed at this stage, but I wonder
whether or not a formal vote of the 3rd draft recommendations would be helpful
to the CCWG. I imagine that it will draw a very clear picture of where the
stakeholder groups/constituencies of one of the CCWG’s chartering organisations
stand on each of the recommendations.
Although these positions have
probably been communicated by the appointed members from the GNSO groups, my
guess would be that the members of the CCWG may still find a Council vote
helpful.
Just a thought.
Thanks.
Amr
> On Jan 13,
2016, at 3:35 PM, Johan Helsingius <julf@julf.com> wrote:
>
>
>
Wolf-Ulrich,
>
>> Maybe tomorrow we could sort out and discuss
the very last not yet
>> agreeable recs. The formal vote could then be
taken at a later stage – maybe
>> even at the council meeting next
week.
>
> I am not entirely sure why a formal vote is needed now,
assuming
> there will have to be one more, final(?) draft - surely what
counts
> is the vote on the *final* version. Or am I wrong in my
assumptions?
>
>
Julf
>
>
>