I agree with everything said. But I ask: who is the end user? I once argued with the CEO of ICANN (Fadi) when he said: "We are all end users." And I replied: it is partially true, but I believe that within ICANN we are all end users with knowledge of all Internet regulations, of our rights and obligations. But we should consider as an end user who is unaware of all this, and therefore, does not have the capacity to fight and demand for their rights. And we end users in the ALS-RALO-ALAC path are responsible for taking concerns and problems to the ICANN board of directors and proposing the necessary solutions for the "end user". Otherwise, only the opinion of the representatives of the ALA-RALO-ALAC will reach the Junta Dieciva, and not of the "end users".

 

Best

 

Alberto

 

De: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> En nombre de gopal via CPWG
Enviado el: jueves, 20 de abril de 2023 19:08
Para: CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Asunto: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Dear All,

 

In my humble opinion, we need to look at the lighter side as well in the context of End - Users. This category brings along with it the following characteristics.

 

Misstated financial statements due to simple data entry or calculation errors in spreadsheets

Regulatory and compliance violations

Operational impacts and losses due to errors

Loss of time stemming from cumbersome manual processes and calculations that could be automated

Data redundancy and version control

Lack of recovery or forensic capabilities

Higher risk of fraud

Redoubtable Audit findings due to lack of control

The serious challenges are:

 

#1: Technology Push to address these concerns is not viable due to economic reasons. The End - Users would

       be with very limited technology options that are several notches below the bleeding - edge ones.

 

#2: Stern Regulatory measures such as the ones being hinted are likely to be counter - productive.

 

Admittedly, the dumb machines and devices reached the end-users much faster than anyone ever expected. A methodology to educate them in that many numbers is frankly beyond my ken at the moment. 

 

Persuasiveness and Negotiations are on the top of the stack in my mind.

 

Your thoughts..

 

Sincerely,

 

 

 

Gopal T V

0 9840121302
https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545
https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Dr. T V Gopal
Professor
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
College of Engineering
Anna University
Chennai - 600 025, INDIA
Ph : (Off) 22351723 Extn. 3340
       (Res) 24454753
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Jonathan Zuck via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Sent: 21 April 2023 02:23
To: mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>; Zak Muscovitch <zak@muscovitch.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

My comedy is broadly funny Mike! 

 

Jonathan Zuck

Director, Future of Work Project

Innovators Network Foundation

www.InnovatorsNetwork.org

 

From: mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:47:14 PM
To: Jonathan Zuck <JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org>; Zak Muscovitch <zak@muscovitch.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: RE: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Jonathan,

 

Perhaps you may want to stick to making your short films.  You are much more in your comedic swim lane with that content  😊

 

Are there any recent videos that you can share? They always seem to bring a smile to my face, although your short western is still my all-time favorite.

 

Best regards,

 

Michael

 

From: Jonathan Zuck <JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:42 PM
To: Zak Muscovitch <zak@muscovitch.com>; mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Oh, sorry about that. I thought George was one of yours.  I suppose no one really wants to take responsibility for him. Honestly, I was really just trying to tease Evan. J

 

Jonathan Zuck

Director, Future of Work Project

Innovators Network Foundation

 

From: Zak Muscovitch <zak@muscovitch.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:36:47 PM
To: Jonathan Zuck <JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org>; mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: RE: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Your apology is accepted. Please note however, that it was not a member of the ICA who made any “outcry” and therefore your statement that you “look forward to ICA's civil and rational evaluation of this outcry by one of its members”, is factually incorrect.

 

Yours truly,

 

Zak Muscovitch

General Counsel, ICA

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Zuck <JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:28 PM
To: Zak Muscovitch <zak@muscovitch.com>; mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Oh Hi Zak. Been a minute. Sorry, I was really just trying to make a joke and engaged in some hyperbole...perhaps a bit like the domain industry does when their interests are at stake...but that's neither here nor there. No real offense intended. I look forward to ICA's civil and rational evaluation of this outcry by one of its members.

Jonathan 

 

Jonathan Zuck

Director, Future of Work Project

Innovators Network Foundation

 

From: Zak Muscovitch <zak@muscovitch.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:19:33 PM
To: Jonathan Zuck <JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org>; mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Jonathan, I don’t appreciate your sentiment of “hating domainers”. It’s not conducive to civil discussion amongst stakeholders, and in any event it is an overly broad generalization without justification. Moreover, attributing Evan's concern to being "spun up by domainers" is another unjustified generalization. 

 

Zak Muscovitch

General Counsel, ICA

 

 

From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Jonathan Zuck via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 4:12 PM
To: mike palage.com <mike@palage.com>; Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Yeah, this is much ado about nothing. It's not like some contract can give a government permission to seize a domain. Sigh. This is just so ICANN can't come after Verisign ( and PIR etc) for accommodating a court order.

 

For someone who hates the domainers, even more than me, Evan is sure spun up by them!

 

Jonathan Zuck

Director, Future of Work Project

Innovators Network Foundation

 

From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of mike palage.com via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 3:56:38 PM
To: Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com>; Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Hello Olivier,

 

Can you provide a public reference to the thread or email list?  I am a sucker for subscribing to a good mailing list.

 

That being said I would agree with John’s statement. As someone who has consulted with many registry operators over the last two decades, the language in the .COM and the now proposed .NET registry agreement is not inconsistent with standards provisions across the industry.

 

Sadly, ICANN only requires Verisign to post its Registry/Registrar agreements. However, I was able to quickly find this legal provision from EURid in connection with .EU registrations, see https://eurid.eu/d/7556497/Terms_and_Conditions_EN.pdf

 

Section 6.4 - The Registry shall be entitled to immediately suspend or cancel the Domain

Name when the Registrant is in breach of the Rules.

 

Section  3. OBLIGATIONS OF THE REGISTRANT

 

Throughout the Term, the Registrant has the following obligations:

1. As referred to in the Registration Policy, to keep its contact information accurate, complete, and up-to-date, both (i) with the Registrar with whom the Registrant has entered into an Agreement and (ii) with the Registry (via the Registrar). Moreover, the Registrant represents and warrants that any email address communicated to the Registry shall be a functioning e-mail

address;

2. To use the Domain Name in such a way that does not violate any third-party rights, applicable laws, or regulations, including discrimination on the basis of race, language, sex, religion, or political view;

3. Not to use the Domain Name (i) in bad faith or (ii) for any unlawful purpose.

 

Section 4. REPRESENTATIONS AND WARRANTIES OF THE REGISTRANT

 

The Registrant represents and warrants that:

 

1. it meets the Eligibility Criteria, and it shall inform the Registry when it ceases to meet such conditions via its Registrar;

2. all information provided to the Registry during the Domain Name registration process is true, complete, and accurate;

3. the Domain Name registration is made in good faith, for a lawful purpose, and does not infringe the rights of any third party;

4. the Domain Name is not contrary to public policy or morality (e.g. is not obscene or offensive), and is not unlawful;

5. throughout the Term, it shall abide by these Terms and Conditions and any and all applicable Rules.

 

Therefore while the Verisign lawyers were a bit verbose our friends at EURid were much more succinct.

 

Net Net – I personally am not losing any sleep over the proposed mark-up to the RRA. That being said there are A LOT of other provisions in the existing/proposed .NET agreement that are giving me angst, so please tune in next Wednesday when Bill and I share our initial assessment and concerns.

 

Best regards,

 

Michael

 

From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> On Behalf Of Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2023 3:28 PM
To: Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org>; CPWG <cpwg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [CPWG] Something of actual importance to end-users

 

Forgot the reference:
https://itp.cdn.icann.org/en/files/registry-agreements/com/com-amend-3-pdf-27mar20-en.pdf

On 20/04/2023 20:26, Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond wrote:

Worth noting: John Levine points out on another mailing list that the changes are the same as those already integrated in the .COM Registry Agreement 3 years ago and that did not cause as many ripples back then.

He also mentions that governments seize gTLD domains all the time when they get a suitable
court order. But of course I guess this is all in the details.

Kindest regards,

Olivier

On 20/04/2023 17:12, Evan Leibovitch via CPWG wrote:

 

Let's briefly put aside the boasting about ALAC's incremental involvement in the trivial agendas set by ICANN's vested interests. Here's a real example of an issue that can negatively affect end-users. The aims of the proposed modification may be laudable, but there's too much room for arbitrariness and too much potential to curb political speech unwanted by a government.

 

BTW ... Why was this not already flagged by ALAC as cause for concern? Why did I have to find out about this in the media rather than from the inside. Was ALAC intending to ignore it?

 

This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. ALAC is obsessed with the trivial and the self-absorbed, but asleep during the issues that actually affect the constituency we're supposed to serve.

 

Does ALAC have what it takes to fight for the public interest on something that actually matters?

Is it capable of balancing the various intertwining issues? If the CPWG meets on this issue I'll be there.


Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada

@evanleibovitch / @el56

 

_______________________________________________
CPWG mailing list
CPWG@icann.org
https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg
 
_______________________________________________
By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.

 

 

-- 
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD
http://www.gih.com/ocl.html