ICANN Blog: The Global Digital Compact: A Top-down Attempt to Minimize the Role of The Technical Community
An interesting new ICANN blog post: https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/the-global-digital-compact-a-top-down... This one's likely to be causing some ripples in the Internet Governance landscape. But some are already asking why are the other RIRs and ISOC not co-signatories? And how about the IETF & World Wide Web foundation? Altogether, it seems like an incomplete set of I* organisations. Or was the piece perhaps meant just as an opinion piece to start a discussion? Kindest regards, Olivier
On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 12:58 PM Wolfgang Kleinwächter via CPWG < cpwg@icann.org> wrote:
Time is ripe to start a new discussion. And to renew the platforms of the non governmental stakeholder groups (I*, IGC, ICC) to organize a coordinated response to the governmental activities, both for GDC as well as for WSIS +20.
Don't wait to be invited for #consultations#. We have to be pro-active.
One way to be proactive is to bring back IGF@ICANN, both during the ICANN meetings and intersessionally, and shape the WG as one that will be emphatic about the need for Technical standards and technical coordination to remain distinctly independent, while at the same time asking to eliminate provocations, if any, for the pointless "tech-nationalism" . IGF@ICANN can not only bring together stakeholders in their respective roles, but also serve as a principal platform.
Wolfgang
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> hat am 23.08.2023 09:14 CEST geschrieben:
An interesting new ICANN blog post:
https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/the-global-digital-compact-a-top-down...
This one's likely to be causing some ripples in the Internet Governance landscape. But some are already asking why are the other RIRs and ISOC not co-signatories? And how about the IETF & World Wide Web foundation?
Altogether, it seems like an incomplete set of I* organisations. Or was the piece perhaps meant just as an opinion piece to start a discussion?
Kindest regards,
Olivier _______________________________________________ CPWG mailing list CPWG@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg _______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy ( https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service ( https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
_______________________________________________ CPWG mailing list CPWG@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg
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Thank you Olivier. Nice blog. Separation of concerns of "Technical" and "Managerial" has been into discussions several times. There is no single formula to achieve this as of now. I suggest reading the article titled "The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both?" at: https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-.... [https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/63eb611746544978b6a636b1/64beb61be5db7f1c4f773c02_Post-Thumb%20(12).png]<https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-or-both#:~:text=often%20conflicting%20ways.-,Much%20like%20the%20sublime%20in%20art%2C%20technology%20evokes%20both%20awe,greater%20detail%20during%20this%20article.> The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both?<https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-...> Much like the sublime in art, technology evokes both awe and a sense of unease. Here, we deep dive further into this duality. www.arcual.art Sincerely, Gopal T V 0 9840121302 https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545 https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Dr. T V Gopal Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering College of Engineering Anna University Chennai - 600 025, INDIA Ph : (Off) 22351723 Extn. 3340 (Res) 24454753 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ________________________________ From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> Sent: 23 August 2023 12:44 To: cpwg@icann.org <cpwg@icann.org> Subject: [CPWG] ICANN Blog: The Global Digital Compact: A Top-down Attempt to Minimize the Role of The Technical Community An interesting new ICANN blog post: https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/the-global-digital-compact-a-top-down... This one's likely to be causing some ripples in the Internet Governance landscape. But some are already asking why are the other RIRs and ISOC not co-signatories? And how about the IETF & World Wide Web foundation? Altogether, it seems like an incomplete set of I* organisations. Or was the piece perhaps meant just as an opinion piece to start a discussion? Kindest regards, Olivier
Thanks for the information Olivier. I just came across an interesting response from Milton Mueller's Internet Governance Project. The Technical Community and Internet Governance: A Response to the Costerton-Curran-Wilson letter <https://www.internetgovernance.org/2023/08/22/the-technical-community-and-in...> I include the last four paragraphs below ... 4. Why it is harmful to make the UN the Boogeyman The most annoying thing about the ICANN-ARIN-APNIC missive, however, is its apparent attempt to revive the old “UN is trying to take over the Internet” meme. This boogeyman has been used by the technical community and the US government to haunt the children of the global multistakeholder community since 2002. When the threat was real, or even real but exaggerated, this was OK. But 7 years after the ICANN transition there is no excuse for it. We have already explained why the UN lacks the power to take over any key Internet governance functions. We have already noted that their only systematic attempt to do that, at WSIS in 2005, totally failed. Reviving this threat narrative, however, does real damage to the public discourse on IG, because it diverts attention from the real threats to the multistakeholder model. We live in a digital environment that is fragmenting along jurisdictional lines. The Europeans are pursuing Digital Sovereignty, as are the Indians and Chinese. The Americans are weaponizing semiconductors, undersea cables, investment capital in ICT, and actively considering blocking Chinese apps; the UK is considering banning end to end encryption, leading to the possible exit of key applications and services from the UK market. Tech nationalism is on the rise everywhere. What we must understand in this context is that the threats to a global Internet come from conflicts between and regulations from sovereign states, not from the UN, a weak intergovernmental institution that can only act when these states all agree. Our advice to Costerton, Curran and Wilson: take a deep breath. Calmly consider what powers the multistakeholder community – which consists of a largely undifferentiated mass of techies, civil society, academics and business – already have in Internet governance. Try to do an accurate accounting of the threats to that governance model. Devote your attention and efforts to those threats. Don’t try to drive the community into pointless battles with ghosts. On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 4:49 AM gopal via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> wrote:
Thank you Olivier.
Nice blog.
Separation of concerns of "Technical" and "Managerial" has been into discussions several times. There is no single formula to achieve this as of now.
I suggest reading the article titled *"The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both?"* at:
https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-....
<https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-...> The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both? <https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-...> Much like the sublime in art, technology evokes both awe and a sense of unease. Here, we deep dive further into this duality. www.arcual.art
Sincerely,
Gopal T V 0 9840121302 https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545 https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Dr. T V Gopal Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering College of Engineering Anna University Chennai - 600 025, INDIA Ph : (Off) 22351723 Extn. 3340 (Res) 24454753 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------ *From:* CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> *Sent:* 23 August 2023 12:44 *To:* cpwg@icann.org <cpwg@icann.org> *Subject:* [CPWG] ICANN Blog: The Global Digital Compact: A Top-down Attempt to Minimize the Role of The Technical Community
An interesting new ICANN blog post:
https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/the-global-digital-compact-a-top-down...
This one's likely to be causing some ripples in the Internet Governance landscape. But some are already asking why are the other RIRs and ISOC not co-signatories? And how about the IETF & World Wide Web foundation?
Altogether, it seems like an incomplete set of I* organisations. Or was the piece perhaps meant just as an opinion piece to start a discussion?
Kindest regards,
Olivier _______________________________________________ CPWG mailing list CPWG@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg
_______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
I quite agree with Milton that this '*sky is falling*' trope is overstated. His list of the real - and greater! - threats to the '*one world, one internet*' principle is hardly debatable. Carlton ============================== *Carlton A Samuels* *Mobile: 876-818-1799Strategy, Process, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround* ============================= On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 at 10:30, David Mackey via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> wrote:
Thanks for the information Olivier.
I just came across an interesting response from Milton Mueller's Internet Governance Project.
The Technical Community and Internet Governance: A Response to the Costerton-Curran-Wilson letter <https://www.internetgovernance.org/2023/08/22/the-technical-community-and-in...>
I include the last four paragraphs below ...
4. Why it is harmful to make the UN the Boogeyman
The most annoying thing about the ICANN-ARIN-APNIC missive, however, is its apparent attempt to revive the old “UN is trying to take over the Internet” meme. This boogeyman has been used by the technical community and the US government to haunt the children of the global multistakeholder community since 2002. When the threat was real, or even real but exaggerated, this was OK. But 7 years after the ICANN transition there is no excuse for it. We have already explained why the UN lacks the power to take over any key Internet governance functions. We have already noted that their only systematic attempt to do that, at WSIS in 2005, totally failed.
Reviving this threat narrative, however, does real damage to the public discourse on IG, because it diverts attention from the real threats to the multistakeholder model.
We live in a digital environment that is fragmenting along jurisdictional lines. The Europeans are pursuing Digital Sovereignty, as are the Indians and Chinese. The Americans are weaponizing semiconductors, undersea cables, investment capital in ICT, and actively considering blocking Chinese apps; the UK is considering banning end to end encryption, leading to the possible exit of key applications and services from the UK market. Tech nationalism is on the rise everywhere. What we must understand in this context is that the threats to a global Internet come from conflicts between and regulations from sovereign states, not from the UN, a weak intergovernmental institution that can only act when these states all agree.
Our advice to Costerton, Curran and Wilson: take a deep breath. Calmly consider what powers the multistakeholder community – which consists of a largely undifferentiated mass of techies, civil society, academics and business – already have in Internet governance. Try to do an accurate accounting of the threats to that governance model. Devote your attention and efforts to those threats. Don’t try to drive the community into pointless battles with ghosts.
On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 4:49 AM gopal via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> wrote:
Thank you Olivier.
Nice blog.
Separation of concerns of "Technical" and "Managerial" has been into discussions several times. There is no single formula to achieve this as of now.
I suggest reading the article titled *"The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both?"* at:
https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-....
<https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-...> The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both? <https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-...> Much like the sublime in art, technology evokes both awe and a sense of unease. Here, we deep dive further into this duality. www.arcual.art
Sincerely,
Gopal T V 0 9840121302 https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545 https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Dr. T V Gopal Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering College of Engineering Anna University Chennai - 600 025, INDIA Ph : (Off) 22351723 Extn. 3340 (Res) 24454753 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------ *From:* CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> *Sent:* 23 August 2023 12:44 *To:* cpwg@icann.org <cpwg@icann.org> *Subject:* [CPWG] ICANN Blog: The Global Digital Compact: A Top-down Attempt to Minimize the Role of The Technical Community
An interesting new ICANN blog post:
https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/the-global-digital-compact-a-top-down...
This one's likely to be causing some ripples in the Internet Governance landscape. But some are already asking why are the other RIRs and ISOC not co-signatories? And how about the IETF & World Wide Web foundation?
Altogether, it seems like an incomplete set of I* organisations. Or was the piece perhaps meant just as an opinion piece to start a discussion?
Kindest regards,
Olivier _______________________________________________ CPWG mailing list CPWG@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg
_______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
_______________________________________________ CPWG mailing list CPWG@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg
_______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
Once again, I'm afraid I have to agree with Milton. That said, you individual governments from coalitions, whether via the UN or not. Jonathan Zuck Director, Future of Work Project Innovators Network Foundation www.InnovatorsNetwork.org ________________________________ From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of David Mackey via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2023 8:29:52 AM To: gopal <gopal@annauniv.edu> Cc: cpwg@icann.org <cpwg@icann.org> Subject: Re: [CPWG] ICANN Blog: The Global Digital Compact: A Top-down Attempt to Minimize the Role of The Technical Community Thanks for the information Olivier. I just came across an interesting response from Milton Mueller's Internet Governance Project. The Technical Community and Internet Governance: A Response to the Costerton-Curran-Wilson letter<https://www.internetgovernance.org/2023/08/22/the-technical-community-and-in...> I include the last four paragraphs below ... 4. Why it is harmful to make the UN the Boogeyman The most annoying thing about the ICANN-ARIN-APNIC missive, however, is its apparent attempt to revive the old “UN is trying to take over the Internet” meme. This boogeyman has been used by the technical community and the US government to haunt the children of the global multistakeholder community since 2002. When the threat was real, or even real but exaggerated, this was OK. But 7 years after the ICANN transition there is no excuse for it. We have already explained why the UN lacks the power to take over any key Internet governance functions. We have already noted that their only systematic attempt to do that, at WSIS in 2005, totally failed. Reviving this threat narrative, however, does real damage to the public discourse on IG, because it diverts attention from the real threats to the multistakeholder model. We live in a digital environment that is fragmenting along jurisdictional lines. The Europeans are pursuing Digital Sovereignty, as are the Indians and Chinese. The Americans are weaponizing semiconductors, undersea cables, investment capital in ICT, and actively considering blocking Chinese apps; the UK is considering banning end to end encryption, leading to the possible exit of key applications and services from the UK market. Tech nationalism is on the rise everywhere. What we must understand in this context is that the threats to a global Internet come from conflicts between and regulations from sovereign states, not from the UN, a weak intergovernmental institution that can only act when these states all agree. Our advice to Costerton, Curran and Wilson: take a deep breath. Calmly consider what powers the multistakeholder community – which consists of a largely undifferentiated mass of techies, civil society, academics and business – already have in Internet governance. Try to do an accurate accounting of the threats to that governance model. Devote your attention and efforts to those threats. Don’t try to drive the community into pointless battles with ghosts. On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 4:49 AM gopal via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org<mailto:cpwg@icann.org>> wrote: Thank you Olivier. Nice blog. Separation of concerns of "Technical" and "Managerial" has been into discussions several times. There is no single formula to achieve this as of now. I suggest reading the article titled "The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both?" at: https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-.... [https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/63eb611746544978b6a636b1/64beb61be5db7f1c4f773c02_Post-Thumb%20(12).png]<https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-or-both#:~:text=often%20conflicting%20ways.-,Much%20like%20the%20sublime%20in%20art%2C%20technology%20evokes%20both%20awe,greater%20detail%20during%20this%20article.> The Technological Sublime: Incredible, terrifying, or both?<https://www.arcual.art/blog/the-technological-sublime-incredible-terrifying-...> Much like the sublime in art, technology evokes both awe and a sense of unease. Here, we deep dive further into this duality. www.arcual.art Sincerely, Gopal T V 0 9840121302 https://vidwan.inflibnet.ac.in/profile/57545 https://www.facebook.com/gopal.tadepalli ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Dr. T V Gopal Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering College of Engineering Anna University Chennai - 600 025, INDIA Ph : (Off) 22351723 Extn. 3340 (Res) 24454753 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ________________________________ From: CPWG <cpwg-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cpwg-bounces@icann.org>> on behalf of Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via CPWG <cpwg@icann.org<mailto:cpwg@icann.org>> Sent: 23 August 2023 12:44 To: cpwg@icann.org<mailto:cpwg@icann.org> <cpwg@icann.org<mailto:cpwg@icann.org>> Subject: [CPWG] ICANN Blog: The Global Digital Compact: A Top-down Attempt to Minimize the Role of The Technical Community An interesting new ICANN blog post: https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/the-global-digital-compact-a-top-down... This one's likely to be causing some ripples in the Internet Governance landscape. But some are already asking why are the other RIRs and ISOC not co-signatories? And how about the IETF & World Wide Web foundation? Altogether, it seems like an incomplete set of I* organisations. Or was the piece perhaps meant just as an opinion piece to start a discussion? Kindest regards, Olivier _______________________________________________ CPWG mailing list CPWG@icann.org<mailto:CPWG@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg _______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
participants (7)
-
Carlton Samuels -
David Mackey -
gopal -
Jonathan Zuck -
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond -
Sivasubramanian M -
Wolfgang Kleinwächter