Hi John, I can’t speak for Margie. But how would you define a proxy registration provider? The definition in the RAA and the recommendations doesn’t work with the registration data policy entering into force next August. How would you define a proxy registration provider? “Anyone registering a domain name on behalf of a third party”? The net would be too broad and impossible to implement. Under that definition, I am a proxy service provider for my brother’s domain name (and his nurse practice website) and my mother-in-law’s domain name (for her vanity email address). But my registrar has no idea I am providing “this service” (we have an employee discount but don’t tell my boss 😉 ). As far as my registrar is concerned, and for that matter, anyone with access to the RDDS records, I am the registrant, and I am liable for any use of those domains. As mentioned during one of our online meetings, this also applies to many companies who register their domain portfolios in the name of their holdings in lieu of their daughter companies, including Margie’s employer. I firmly believe that this PDP aims at regulating privacy providers and not law firms and occasional registrations on behalf of friends and families. Let alone law firms that would legally not be authorised to disclose the names of their clients. The contractual obligation between them and ICANN already exists, they are considered registrants or Registered Name Holder/RNH as Reg Levy hammered down during her outstanding presentation. Do let me know if I need to be clarified! Luc From: John McCabe <rysg.whoswho@gmail.com> Date: Wednesday, 20 November 2024 at 20:51 To: PPSAI IRT members, including observers <gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl@icann.org> Cc: Luc SEUFER <lseufer@namespace.com> Subject: Re: [Gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl] Privacy/Proxy Service actual offering Thank you for sharing this with the team, Luc, You write that, "In practice, there are only three main scenarios of redaction and proxy registrations, and only one of them should be subject to this policy." You then go on to summarize about #2. Proxy Registrations concluding that, "The accreditation system is not needed here." You write: "2. Proxy registration "Domains are registered on behalf of others. This may happen for a variety of reasons: the underlying registrant isn’t tech savvy, the registrant licenses the right to use the domain name to one or several licensees, or a lawyer holds a domain name on behalf of their client. "In all those cases, the registrar does not know who the underlying registrant is and thus cannot disclose this information, even if presented with an actionable request. "The accreditation system is not needed here." Speaking in my individual capacity, it seems to me that an outcome such as you propose misses the point of PPS Accreditation. My understanding is that a principal objective of Privacy and Proxy Services Accreditation is to create contractual obligations between Privacy and Proxy Service Providers and ICANN, given that up to now none exist (with the exception of ICANN-contracted parties including Registrars). If my understanding is correct, and the speaker from Facebook was truthful when she reported being stymied in their ongoing efforts to disclose registrant data for infringing domain users, then I cannot readily see justification for concluding pf "Proxy registration" that "The accreditation system is not needed here." To the contrary, my take-away from the excellent session organized by Dennis Chang and his team is that the accreditation system is very much needed to compel data disclosure. Of course, I may be off-base and/or incorrect, and hope that in such case you will please educate me further. Respectfully, John McCabe On Wed, Nov 20, 2024 at 1:16 PM Luc SEUFER via Gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl <gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl@icann.org<mailto:gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl@icann.org>> wrote: Hi Team, I hope you all made it safely back home. It’s a shameless plug, but I trust it can help the group. I wrote it as an update to Owen's presentation of the post-2013 RRA landscape. I can give you examples if needed. https://www.eurodns.com/blog/icann-81-istanbul-insights#privacy-and-proxy-se... All the best, Luc SEUFER CLO | Namespace Group [A picture containing tableware, plate, drawing, food Description automatically generated] mobile: +352 691 600 417<tel:+352691600417> office: +352 27 220 166<tel:+35227220166> lseufer@namespace.com<mailto:lseufer@namespace.com> www.namespace.com<http://www.namespace.com/> _______________________________________________ Gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl mailing list -- gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl@icann.org<mailto:gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl@icann.org> To unsubscribe send an email to gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl-leave@icann.org<mailto:gdd-gnso-ppsai-impl-leave@icann.org> _______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). 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