Re: [gnso-irtpd] here's the little summary of that sequence of events i rattled off on the call just now -- registrant role in TDRP
hi Rob, can you expand on why you prefer the idea that Compliance get's involved over making a determination? i think we're on to something here, so i'm just looking for ideas on what the appropriate role would be for Compliance, not trying to mousetrap you. thanks, mikey On Dec 5, 2013, at 6:24 AM, "Rob Golding" <rob.golding@astutium.com> wrote:
so can we say that in cases where the registrant and their registrar disagree about the merits of the case, they should go to Compliance for a determination?
For compliance to get involved, yes.
Rob
PHONE: 651-647-6109, FAX: 866-280-2356, WEB: www.haven2.com, HANDLE: OConnorStP (ID for Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, etc.)
can you expand on why you prefer the idea that Compliance get's involved over making a determination?
Depends on your definition of 'determination' - I more expect them to review things and prompt the registrar(s) as necessary (subject to previous posts about fees) if policy has not been followed. Afterall isn't compliance role/remit to ensure that all registrars follow policy/process? If a registrant thinks that is not what has been done, they already have the option(s) to talk to compliance (and we all know registrants regularly talk to them about complete nonsense/trivia anyway) .
just looking for ideas on what the appropriate role would be for Compliance, not trying to mousetrap you.
The appropriate role would be for them to do their job, just their job and only their job - and to apply/enforce those items of policy fairly and consistently across all registrars... Rob
Maybe I can answer this one: The role of compliance is to investigate compliance issues with regard to registrar obligations under the RAA and compliance policies. If either the gaining or losing registrar is found by compliance to have violated its obligations, enforcement action by compliance would include giving that registrar time to fix the breach, i.e. solve the registrants issue. Volker
hi Rob,
can you expand on why you prefer the idea that Compliance get's involved over making a determination? i think we're on to something here, so i'm just looking for ideas on what the appropriate role would be for Compliance, not trying to mousetrap you.
thanks,
mikey
On Dec 5, 2013, at 6:24 AM, "Rob Golding" <rob.golding@astutium.com> wrote:
so can we say that in cases where the registrant and their registrar disagree about the merits of the case, they should go to Compliance for a determination? For compliance to get involved, yes.
Rob
PHONE: 651-647-6109, FAX: 866-280-2356, WEB: www.haven2.com, HANDLE: OConnorStP (ID for Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, etc.)
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung. Mit freundlichen Grüßen, Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen. -------------------------------------------- Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Best regards, Volker A. Greimann - legal department - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
I'm not disagreeing. I'm thinking about this from a capacity concern. In order to find the registrant disputes that qualify as a registrar violation, ICANN will have to sift through a lot of claims. Some meritorious, some marginally so, many a complete waste of time. This is particularly true because ICANN compliance doesn't charge to investigate claims, so there is no harm to a registrant for whining to ICANN about frivolous matters. While, from an academic standpoint, ICANN compliance maybe "should" weed out registrant concerns with their registrars, one by one, if they do not have the capacity, tossing this to compliance will have the same effect as doing nothing. Perhaps the conversation is heading towards how to recommend ICANN deal with this or we recommend a staff person be hired, whatever. I just think that whatever we propose, we need to be mindful of the practicalities of it as well. Kristine -----Original Message----- From: owner-gnso-irtpd@icann.org [mailto:owner-gnso-irtpd@icann.org] On Behalf Of Volker Greimann Sent: Friday, December 06, 2013 3:27 AM To: Mike O'Connor; gnso-irtpd@icann.org Subject: Re: [gnso-irtpd] here's the little summary of that sequence of events i rattled off on the call just now -- registrant role in TDRP Maybe I can answer this one: The role of compliance is to investigate compliance issues with regard to registrar obligations under the RAA and compliance policies. If either the gaining or losing registrar is found by compliance to have violated its obligations, enforcement action by compliance would include giving that registrar time to fix the breach, i.e. solve the registrants issue. Volker
hi Rob,
can you expand on why you prefer the idea that Compliance get's involved over making a determination? i think we're on to something here, so i'm just looking for ideas on what the appropriate role would be for Compliance, not trying to mousetrap you.
thanks,
mikey
On Dec 5, 2013, at 6:24 AM, "Rob Golding" <rob.golding@astutium.com> wrote:
so can we say that in cases where the registrant and their registrar disagree about the merits of the case, they should go to Compliance for a determination? For compliance to get involved, yes.
Rob
PHONE: 651-647-6109, FAX: 866-280-2356, WEB: www.haven2.com, HANDLE: OConnorStP (ID for Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, etc.)
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung. Mit freundlichen Grüßen, Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen. -------------------------------------------- Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Best regards, Volker A. Greimann - legal department - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
As an aside n this, ICANN already weeds out frivolous complaints. Whois complaints have tremendously improved over the past 2 years due to ICANN staff at least lookijng at them before forwarding. And we also see a few transfer complaints coming trough ICANN. These are usually easily resolved as it was about a reseller that went under oder incommunicado and the registrant needed their auth-codes. So what I am getting at is that there already is such a function in place within ICANN compliance that deals with registrant complaints over registrars. Volker
I'm not disagreeing. I'm thinking about this from a capacity concern.
In order to find the registrant disputes that qualify as a registrar violation, ICANN will have to sift through a lot of claims. Some meritorious, some marginally so, many a complete waste of time. This is particularly true because ICANN compliance doesn't charge to investigate claims, so there is no harm to a registrant for whining to ICANN about frivolous matters.
While, from an academic standpoint, ICANN compliance maybe "should" weed out registrant concerns with their registrars, one by one, if they do not have the capacity, tossing this to compliance will have the same effect as doing nothing.
Perhaps the conversation is heading towards how to recommend ICANN deal with this or we recommend a staff person be hired, whatever. I just think that whatever we propose, we need to be mindful of the practicalities of it as well.
Kristine
-----Original Message----- From: owner-gnso-irtpd@icann.org [mailto:owner-gnso-irtpd@icann.org] On Behalf Of Volker Greimann Sent: Friday, December 06, 2013 3:27 AM To: Mike O'Connor; gnso-irtpd@icann.org Subject: Re: [gnso-irtpd] here's the little summary of that sequence of events i rattled off on the call just now -- registrant role in TDRP
Maybe I can answer this one:
The role of compliance is to investigate compliance issues with regard to registrar obligations under the RAA and compliance policies. If either the gaining or losing registrar is found by compliance to have violated its obligations, enforcement action by compliance would include giving that registrar time to fix the breach, i.e. solve the registrants issue.
Volker
hi Rob,
can you expand on why you prefer the idea that Compliance get's involved over making a determination? i think we're on to something here, so i'm just looking for ideas on what the appropriate role would be for Compliance, not trying to mousetrap you.
thanks,
mikey
On Dec 5, 2013, at 6:24 AM, "Rob Golding" <rob.golding@astutium.com> wrote:
so can we say that in cases where the registrant and their registrar disagree about the merits of the case, they should go to Compliance for a determination? For compliance to get involved, yes.
Rob
PHONE: 651-647-6109, FAX: 866-280-2356, WEB: www.haven2.com, HANDLE: OConnorStP (ID for Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, etc.)
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann - legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems
CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung. Mit freundlichen Grüßen, Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen. -------------------------------------------- Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Best regards, Volker A. Greimann - legal department - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
participants (4)
-
Dorrain, Kristine -
Mike O'Connor -
Rob Golding -
Volker Greimann