MP3 PPSAI WG Webinar- Thursday 28 May 2015 at 1400 UTC
Dear All, Please find the MP3 recording for the Privacy and Proxy Services Accreditation Issues PDP Working group call held on Thursday 28 May 2015 at 14:00 UTC at: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-28may15-en.mp3<http://mailer.samanage.com/wf/click?upn=NrFWbrBstcrPWP369qgbqlXiSKeL20xnUXzI03ZqpsusbjlzngYZmv8lp-2FEQVg4-2B5QcMgiNBkTAyABZE3CWvxw-3D-3D_QuA5zZR9ZZ7J1F2FeF-2FOsgm1hgIDcBrAX2P7Ezxmql7ckJc4ios1-2BxObAoz2rzLSI3c4QB1NGo7bw7XrBjpRCbz74w4vzk48UxZMFoBBQBQaQ0ePdiOjdJ30sQNHkokOf-2F2p-2FBvMgKvMhzp-2B4u8fP-2BRrSytHe2KCf2HpQmtSbpezMgNTUG57PiORAPesOotpHA-2BC4pSmXJRsVmpbNaLqzjLkNQfnpT7XYNBgegtXAxxgeNqmghce7WrGa5VQt6SFoAuB9uNk4qa1JbqYA0z9RS2iPz7RwA0czTQtNk-2FCwC3T98PTe8GijiBrAdkyR2bhqx0HhGCbIVAEBPV3sZpnn5J871qPcLtjyChe3hgIXD1VUncrUOUdpKzJQpGVNVxxNf8-2FFE4PxqVidMxi8jNT8RSPcKh2w5-2FznbgTZyVmHL958ekgMbKsRhOq5TuYyF9-2FUgzvvb1pdhyLvKBHpb3WvBFR7wD11ySk1so-2BgWWfceGEf-2FctkNxYM2pnI-2FCDpjwy> On page: <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar>http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may><http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#apr>m<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may>ay<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/ Please find webinar attendance in the AC room attached to this email ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Mailing list archives: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg/ Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/9iCfAg Thank you. Kind regards, Nathalie ------------------------------- Adobe Connect chat transcript for Thursday 28 May 2015 Nathalie Peregrine:Dear all, welcome to the Privacy & Proxy Services Accreditation Issues Working Group Webinar on the 28th May 2015 Nathalie Peregrine:Dear all, we will be streaming audio in the AC for the presentation. If you want to ask a question at the end of the webinar, please dial into the audio bridge, or type it in the chat Volker A. Greimann:audible, graeme Graeme Bunton:Double Stephanie Perrin's, how fun! Volker A. Greimann:i hear you stephanie Perrin 2:You know I can always argue both sides of an argument then, Graeme! Bladel:Hmm... no audio on this end. JUst me? Nathalie Peregrine:There is audio streaming in the AC room Nathalie Peregrine:VoIP mics are disabled for this session Bladel:No sound, will join the bridge. Nathalie Peregrine:to ask a question at the end of the call, please dial into the audio bridge, or feel free to type them here steve metalitz:Great to see Don here! steve metalitz:July 7 is correct as comment closing date Don Blumenthal:Thanks Steve, Graeme, and Mary. The timing is perfect for giving me a way to catch up.:) I wonder if I should find a deeper meaning to the fact that comments close on my birthday.. Mary Wong:@Don, I take that as an excellent sign of good things to come ... esp since we didn't know this additional significant fact when we published the report! Amr Elsadr:Has the WG reached any consensus on using the PICS/GAC safeguards as examples of malicious conduct? Mary Wong:@Amr, yes, to the extent that the WG suggests that these could be starting points for developing a list of such. Mary Wong:In this slide, and in the Initial Report, where the WG is still considering draft language for which it has not yet reached consensus, square brackets have been placed around the language still under discussion. Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry I am so late, I was delayed in a previous meeting Mary Wong:Welcome, Osvaldo! Jim Prendergast, The Galway Strategy Group:How is reasonable defined? Mary Wong:@Jim, the WG did not delve into a more specific definition. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Does the first question imply that law firms may not register names on behalf of their clients if their clients are financial service providers? Amr Elsadr:Does "financial transactions for commercial purposes" include banks? Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Or more generally are law firms, designated agents and others considered proxy providers? Joyce Lin 2:commercial purpose ? All the sites with ads on are for commercial purpose. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Even more generally, what is the definition of a proxy/privacy registration? Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):Is it anticipated that a P/P accreditation program would be implemented concurrent with the expiry of the interim spec. or is there another timeline in mind? Amr Elsadr:@Jeff: "Others" also include web developers who might unknowingly be categorized as privacy/proxy services, especially in developing countries. Mary Wong:Hi all - as there is a series of questions typed into the chat, I will ask Graeme and Steve to answer them in turn during Q&A, if that's all right. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Please...not in a position to dial in right now, but on Adobe Mary Wong:No problem! Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):that would be great mary Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):thank you Amr Elsadr:Yes. Thanks Steve and Graeme. Amr Elsadr:<QUESTION>Wondering if the WG members have made a distinction between "financial transactions for a commercial purpose" vs. for a non-commercial purposes? Also, how is a p/p service provider meant to make this determination at the time of domain name registration?<QUESTION> Volker A. Greimann:short answer Steve: Probably yes. Susan Payne:Q: isnt a law firm which registers for use by a client a proxy? Susan Payne:I dont know any law firsm which would accept responsibility for their client's activities :) Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):I think that topic needs more work by the working group because I am not sure I see the differences as clearly as is being stated Bladel:If this is a regular part of their client services, then obtaining accreditation seems like a trivial matter. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):But abiding by the accreditation standards may be in conflict with their legal obligations Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):and a violation of attorney client privilege Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):(maybe not the relay...but the reveal may be a violation of attorney client privilege) Amr Elsadr:A lot of independent web developers might be registering domain names for their clients, while being oblivious to p/p accreditation issues. Bladel:In this case, providers are volunteering to create an exception (client contact data), so why would this necessarily be privileged? Volker A. Greimann:question: what benefit does accreditation confer that would not be also provided by ICANN certification? Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):law firms are not "providers" Volker A. Greimann:i.e. is accreditation really necessary? Bladel:Not asking for communications between law firm and client, just idenification of client. How is that privileged? Volker A. Greimann:Jeff: If they provide a service, they are a service provider. Volker A. Greimann:provider of that service Nathalie Peregrine:@ Stephanie, your AC mic will not b enabled for this session. Please dial into the audio bridge if you wish to ask your question orally. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):James.....the definition of what is in attorney client privilege is the subject of volumes of treatises and case law :) stephanie Perrin 2: I have dialed in. Am on the phone now. Nathalie Peregrine:excellent Amr Elsadr:@Steve: Thanks. The text on the slide earlier said "financial transaction for a commercial purpose". Was wondering if that was intentional to make a distinction to for non-commercial purposes. Bladel:Fine. But this can be waived in exchange for providing the serivce, correct? And how does this apply to providers outside the US? Amr Elsadr:@Graeme: Thanks. :) Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):thanks Nathalie Peregrine:yes we can hear Amr Elsadr:@Stephanie: Thanks. That sort of addresses my earlier question. Bladel:On the flip side, Providers could just set up law firms. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):or just "agents for service of process" Amr Elsadr:@James: ICANN accreditted law firms!! :) Joyce Lin 2:Who will be policing a domain name to see if it is a financial transaction type of domain? Bladel:Sure. Whatever they're calling it in the Cayman Islands these days. :) Don Blumenthal:@Amr Tjat stephanie Perrin 2:James, are you on the HR committee for the law societies? I know there are a lot of unemployed young lawyers in North America these days....:-) Don Blumenthal:@Amr That's truly sick Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Thanks Steve and Graeme Amr Elsadr::) Holly Raiche:Thanks to Steve and Graeme Bladel:Thanks Steve, Graeme & Mary Jennifer Standiford:Thanks Everyone Amr Elsadr:Thanks Steve, Graeme and Mary. Sara Bockey:thank you all Susan Payne:thanks very much for this session Frank Michlick:thank you for attending Frank Michlick:and thank you for hosting :) Graeme Bunton:And another thx to Staff for putting the report together and he;ping with this webinar Mary Wong:Aww thanks stephanie Perrin 2:Thanks all! Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):thanks all
Hello everyone, staff would like to thank Steve and Graeme for their presentations during the webinar yesterday, and note in particular that we thought they did a remarkable job condensing the complexities of our deliberations, highlighting the major points, and presenting the various recommendations and questions clearly and comprehensively! We also wanted to acknowledge Don¹s continuing support for this WG, as he was present yesterday as well we hope everything is going well for you, Don! In addition to the recording and transcript, WG members may find the Adobe Connect chat transcript (included in the email below from Nathalie) useful in showing some of the points that attendees raised for questioning and discussion. Cheers Mary Mary Wong Senior Policy Director Internet Corporation for Assigned Names & Numbers (ICANN) Telephone: +1 603 574 4889 Email: mary.wong@icann.org From: Nathalie Peregrine <nathalie.peregrine@icann.org> Date: Friday, May 29, 2015 at 07:59 To: "gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org" <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org> Cc: "gnso-secs@icann.org" <gnso-secs@icann.org> Subject: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] MP3 PPSAI WG Webinar- Thursday 28 May 2015 at 1400 UTC
Dear All, Please find the MP3 recording for the Privacy and Proxy Services Accreditation Issues PDP Working group call held on Thursday 28 May 2015 at 14:00 UTC at: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-28may15-en.mp3 <http://mailer.samanage.com/wf/click?upn=NrFWbrBstcrPWP369qgbqlXiSKeL20xnUXzI... 3ZqpsusbjlzngYZmv8lp-2FEQVg4-2B5QcMgiNBkTAyABZE3CWvxw-3D-3D_QuA5zZR9ZZ7J1F2FeF -2FOsgm1hgIDcBrAX2P7Ezxmql7ckJc4ios1-2BxObAoz2rzLSI3c4QB1NGo7bw7XrBjpRCbz74w4v zk48UxZMFoBBQBQaQ0ePdiOjdJ30sQNHkokOf-2F2p-2FBvMgKvMhzp-2B4u8fP-2BRrSytHe2KCf2 HpQmtSbpezMgNTUG57PiORAPesOotpHA-2BC4pSmXJRsVmpbNaLqzjLkNQfnpT7XYNBgegtXAxxgeN qmghce7WrGa5VQt6SFoAuB9uNk4qa1JbqYA0z9RS2iPz7RwA0czTQtNk-2FCwC3T98PTe8GijiBrAd kyR2bhqx0HhGCbIVAEBPV3sZpnn5J871qPcLtjyChe3hgIXD1VUncrUOUdpKzJQpGVNVxxNf8-2FFE 4PxqVidMxi8jNT8RSPcKh2w5-2FznbgTZyVmHL958ekgMbKsRhOq5TuYyF9-2FUgzvvb1pdhyLvKBH pb3WvBFR7wD11ySk1so-2BgWWfceGEf-2FctkNxYM2pnI-2FCDpjwy>
On page: <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar> http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar# <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may> <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#apr> m <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may> ay <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may>
The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:
http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/
Please find webinar attendance in the AC room attached to this email
** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **
Mailing list archives: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg/
Wiki page:
https://community.icann.org/x/9iCfAg
Thank you.
Kind regards,
Nathalie
-------------------------------
Adobe Connect chat transcript for Thursday 28 May 2015
Nathalie Peregrine:Dear all, welcome to the Privacy & Proxy Services Accreditation Issues Working Group Webinar on the 28th May 2015 Nathalie Peregrine:Dear all, we will be streaming audio in the AC for the presentation. If you want to ask a question at the end of the webinar, please dial into the audio bridge, or type it in the chat Volker A. Greimann:audible, graeme Graeme Bunton:Double Stephanie Perrin's, how fun! Volker A. Greimann:i hear you stephanie Perrin 2:You know I can always argue both sides of an argument then, Graeme! Bladel:Hmm... no audio on this end. JUst me? Nathalie Peregrine:There is audio streaming in the AC room Nathalie Peregrine:VoIP mics are disabled for this session Bladel:No sound, will join the bridge. Nathalie Peregrine:to ask a question at the end of the call, please dial into the audio bridge, or feel free to type them here steve metalitz:Great to see Don here! steve metalitz:July 7 is correct as comment closing date Don Blumenthal:Thanks Steve, Graeme, and Mary. The timing is perfect for giving me a way to catch up.:) I wonder if I should find a deeper meaning to the fact that comments close on my birthday.. Mary Wong:@Don, I take that as an excellent sign of good things to come ... esp since we didn't know this additional significant fact when we published the report! Amr Elsadr:Has the WG reached any consensus on using the PICS/GAC safeguards as examples of malicious conduct? Mary Wong:@Amr, yes, to the extent that the WG suggests that these could be starting points for developing a list of such. Mary Wong:In this slide, and in the Initial Report, where the WG is still considering draft language for which it has not yet reached consensus, square brackets have been placed around the language still under discussion. Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry I am so late, I was delayed in a previous meeting Mary Wong:Welcome, Osvaldo! Jim Prendergast, The Galway Strategy Group:How is reasonable defined? Mary Wong:@Jim, the WG did not delve into a more specific definition. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Does the first question imply that law firms may not register names on behalf of their clients if their clients are financial service providers? Amr Elsadr:Does "financial transactions for commercial purposes" include banks? Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Or more generally are law firms, designated agents and others considered proxy providers? Joyce Lin 2:commercial purpose ? All the sites with ads on are for commercial purpose. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Even more generally, what is the definition of a proxy/privacy registration? Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):Is it anticipated that a P/P accreditation program would be implemented concurrent with the expiry of the interim spec. or is there another timeline in mind? Amr Elsadr:@Jeff: "Others" also include web developers who might unknowingly be categorized as privacy/proxy services, especially in developing countries. Mary Wong:Hi all - as there is a series of questions typed into the chat, I will ask Graeme and Steve to answer them in turn during Q&A, if that's all right. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Please...not in a position to dial in right now, but on Adobe Mary Wong:No problem! Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):that would be great mary Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):thank you Amr Elsadr:Yes. Thanks Steve and Graeme. Amr Elsadr:<QUESTION>Wondering if the WG members have made a distinction between "financial transactions for a commercial purpose" vs. for a non-commercial purposes? Also, how is a p/p service provider meant to make this determination at the time of domain name registration?<QUESTION> Volker A. Greimann:short answer Steve: Probably yes. Susan Payne:Q: isnt a law firm which registers for use by a client a proxy? Susan Payne:I dont know any law firsm which would accept responsibility for their client's activities :) Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):I think that topic needs more work by the working group because I am not sure I see the differences as clearly as is being stated Bladel:If this is a regular part of their client services, then obtaining accreditation seems like a trivial matter. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):But abiding by the accreditation standards may be in conflict with their legal obligations Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):and a violation of attorney client privilege Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):(maybe not the relay...but the reveal may be a violation of attorney client privilege) Amr Elsadr:A lot of independent web developers might be registering domain names for their clients, while being oblivious to p/p accreditation issues. Bladel:In this case, providers are volunteering to create an exception (client contact data), so why would this necessarily be privileged? Volker A. Greimann:question: what benefit does accreditation confer that would not be also provided by ICANN certification? Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):law firms are not "providers" Volker A. Greimann:i.e. is accreditation really necessary? Bladel:Not asking for communications between law firm and client, just idenification of client. How is that privileged? Volker A. Greimann:Jeff: If they provide a service, they are a service provider. Volker A. Greimann:provider of that service Nathalie Peregrine:@ Stephanie, your AC mic will not b enabled for this session. Please dial into the audio bridge if you wish to ask your question orally. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):James.....the definition of what is in attorney client privilege is the subject of volumes of treatises and case law :) stephanie Perrin 2: I have dialed in. Am on the phone now. Nathalie Peregrine:excellent Amr Elsadr:@Steve: Thanks. The text on the slide earlier said "financial transaction for a commercial purpose". Was wondering if that was intentional to make a distinction to for non-commercial purposes. Bladel:Fine. But this can be waived in exchange for providing the serivce, correct? And how does this apply to providers outside the US? Amr Elsadr:@Graeme: Thanks. :) Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):thanks Nathalie Peregrine:yes we can hear Amr Elsadr:@Stephanie: Thanks. That sort of addresses my earlier question. Bladel:On the flip side, Providers could just set up law firms. Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):or just "agents for service of process" Amr Elsadr:@James: ICANN accreditted law firms!! :) Joyce Lin 2:Who will be policing a domain name to see if it is a financial transaction type of domain? Bladel:Sure. Whatever they're calling it in the Cayman Islands these days. :) Don Blumenthal:@Amr Tjat stephanie Perrin 2:James, are you on the HR committee for the law societies? I know there are a lot of unemployed young lawyers in North America these days....:-) Don Blumenthal:@Amr That's truly sick Jeff Neuman (Com Laude):Thanks Steve and Graeme Amr Elsadr::) Holly Raiche:Thanks to Steve and Graeme Bladel:Thanks Steve, Graeme & Mary Jennifer Standiford:Thanks Everyone Amr Elsadr:Thanks Steve, Graeme and Mary. Sara Bockey:thank you all Susan Payne:thanks very much for this session Frank Michlick:thank you for attending Frank Michlick:and thank you for hosting :) Graeme Bunton:And another thx to Staff for putting the report together and he;ping with this webinar Mary Wong:Aww thanks stephanie Perrin 2:Thanks all! Stephanie Duchesneau (neustar):thanks all
participants (2)
-
Mary Wong -
Nathalie Peregrine