Yet we hear claims on this list again and again that it is used by internet users all the time to verify whether the site they want to conduct commercial transactions on is legit.
>>Ah, you misunderstood me. I meant that when I, a customer, get ripped off by an Amazon marketplace seller, Amazon will in all likelyhood not provide me with all data they have on the culprit. Even the police may need a subpoena.
And the registrar doesn't publish payment info when the customer pays with a fake credit card. the comparison to WHOIS is nonsensical. WHOIS is not involved in private commercial transactions.
That does not mean we can act however we please, can set aside consumer rights and ignore all laws.
>>There has to be some form of due process, anything else is anarchy.
The Internet is in a state of anarchy.
If provided with actual evidence of wilful use of incorrect data and the data either remains uncorrected or no evidence of acuracy of the correction is presented, then you will find that many registrars will deactivate the domain. For many, the threat of suspension of their domain is compulsion enough.>>Verification may be impossible. Validation on the other hand is possible. If you do not like the policy as it stands, propose an alternative solution. Ideally also tell us who will pay for it.
I do not actually think that physical addresses and phone numbers should be verified. I am saying that this dance around the issue of correct WHOIS data is a hilarious joke. You seem to have legal obligations to pretend otherwise, as a registrar, but I don't and I'm pointing out the nakedness of this particular emperor. There is absolutely no compulsion to provide correct info. I challenge you to prove me wrong.
On Wed, Feb 15, 2017 at 5:00 AM, Volker Greimann <vgreimann@key-systems.net> wrote:
______________________________Hi Greg,
that is a totally different issue. Maybe such services need better regulation, but as long as the policy requirements are met, taking action solely based on the use of such services is impossible.
Volker
Am 14.02.2017 um 20:19 schrieb Greg Aaron:
All best,
--Greg
From: gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.
org [mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org ] On Behalf Of Hollenbeck, Scott
Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2017 1:57 PM
To: 'elsakoo@gmail.com' <elsakoo@gmail.com>
Cc: 'gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org' <gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Dangers of public whois
From: allison nixon [mailto:elsakoo@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 14, 2017 1:35 PM
To: Hollenbeck, Scott <shollenbeck@verisign.com>
Cc: vgreimann@key-systems.net; gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Dangers of public whois
>>[SAH] Actually, there *are* requirements to provide valid data and for registrars to perform validation processing:
How do you expect toothless policy to work *on the Internet*? Seriously?
Yes, seriously. Registrars who do not implement the policy are subject to having their accreditation revoked. ICANN has, in fact, revoked or suspended accreditations. Here are two examples:
https://www.icann.org/news/
announcement-2-2007-03-16-en
https://www.icann.org/en/
system/files/correspondence/ serad-to-patel-2-18jul14-en.
worst that can happen when you put in fake whois data is that your domain gets reported, you change "123 fake st" to "124 fake st", and your registrar is satisfied because what more can they possibly do. I know this because I went through this with an old sinkhole domain. It's a total joke. Let's not pretend it's anything more than that.
Not true. A fake email address, for example, can be detected easily when email sent to it (one of the registrar’s validation requirements) gets bounced back. The worst that can happen is that your domain gets put into some non-operational state (“suspend the registration” per the RAA).
Scott
_______________________________________________ gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/ listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg -- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung. Mit freundlichen Grüßen, Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen. -------------------------------------------- Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Best regards, Volker A. Greimann - legal department - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone. _________________ gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/ listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg --_________________________________ Note to self: Pillage BEFORE burning.
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung. Mit freundlichen Grüßen, Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen. -------------------------------------------- Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Best regards, Volker A. Greimann - legal department - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.