Tongan evidence for line 62 of Latin GP Code Points
Dear Mats, in the shared Dropbox I created a folder Tongan, which contains a file called "tongan-lg.pdf". On pages 14-15 you can find further details about the orthography. Long vowels are represented in Tongan orthograpy by use of a Macron ("long vowels, as in màlò"). Meanwhile definiteness is marked by stress, which is is written in Tongan using a rising accent ´ following the vowel ("The fakamamafa pau or defi nitive accent falls on the fi nal vowel of a word and designates defi niteness, as in tangata ́ (the man). An example of the difference that the defi nitive accent can make is this: ko e tangata means “a man” but ko e tangata ́ means “the man”.") Logically this leaves us with a sequence ā´, which should be confirmed by an expert on the language. Meanwhile Wikipedia <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tongan_language#Tongan_alphabet> informs us that "Although the acute accent has been available on most personal computers from their early days onwards, when Tongan newspapers started to use computers around 1990 to produce their papers, they were unable to find, or failed to enter, the proper keystrokes, and it grew into a habit to put the accent after the vowel instead of on it: not á but a´. But as this distance seemed to be too big, a demand arose for Tongan fonts where the acute accent was shifted to the right, a position halfway in between the two extremes above. Most papers still follow this practice.". This is why I commented this in column J "Possible variant of ā´ ". I hope this clarifies the situation. Best, Meikal
Thank you. I also read that acute accent could, in some writing, be used to indicate stress, but I saw no evidence of the combination of macron and acute accent. As I understand it, a vowel with macron is stressed. Have you seen any data where they have used that combination? Yours, Mats --- Mats Dufberg DNS Specialist, IIS Mobile: +46 73 065 3899 https://www.iis.se/en/ From: Meikal Mumin <meikal.mumin@uni-koeln.de> Date: Tuesday 12 December 2017 at 18:20 To: Mats Dufberg <mats.dufberg@iis.se> Cc: Latin GP <LatinGP@icann.org> Subject: Tongan evidence for line 62 of Latin GP Code Points Dear Mats, in the shared Dropbox I created a folder Tongan, which contains a file called "tongan-lg.pdf". On pages 14-15 you can find further details about the orthography. Long vowels are represented in Tongan orthograpy by use of a Macron ("long vowels, as in màlò"). Meanwhile definiteness is marked by stress, which is is written in Tongan using a rising accent ´ following the vowel ("The fakamamafa pau or defi nitive accent falls on the fi nal vowel of a word and designates defi niteness, as in tangata ́ (the man). An example of the difference that the defi nitive accent can make is this: ko e tangata means “a man” but ko e tangata ́ means “the man”.") Logically this leaves us with a sequence ā´, which should be confirmed by an expert on the language. Meanwhile Wikipedia<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tongan_language#Tongan_alphabet> informs us that "Although the acute accent has been available on most personal computers from their early days onwards, when Tongan newspapers started to use computers around 1990 to produce their papers, they were unable to find, or failed to enter, the proper keystrokes, and it grew into a habit to put the accent after the vowel instead of on it: not á but a´. But as this distance seemed to be too big, a demand arose for Tongan fonts where the acute accent was shifted to the right, a position halfway in between the two extremes above. Most papers still follow this practice.". This is why I commented this in column J "Possible variant of ā´ ". I hope this clarifies the situation. Best, Meikal
I am curious as to whether an acute accent after the vowel, even if only "halfway between the two extremes", would be considered indistinguishable from an apostrophe. (Just as the "turned comma" used in Hawai'ian is.) Which would make it a "punctuation mark", would it not? Bill Jouris Inside Products bill.jouris@insidethestack.com 831-659-8360 925-855-9512 (direct) From: Meikal Mumin <meikal.mumin@uni-koeln.de> To: Mats Dufberg <mats.dufberg@iis.se> Cc: Latin GP <LatinGP@icann.org> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 9:20 AM Subject: [Latingp] Tongan evidence for line 62 of Latin GP Code Points Dear Mats, in the shared Dropbox I created a folder Tongan, which contains a file called "tongan-lg.pdf". On pages 14-15 you can find further details about the orthography. Long vowels are represented in Tongan orthograpy by use of a Macron ("long vowels, as in màlò"). Meanwhile definiteness is marked by stress, which is is written in Tongan using a rising accent ´ following the vowel ("The fakamamafa pau or defi nitive accent falls on the fi nal vowel of a word and designates defi niteness, as in tangata ́ (the man). An example of the difference that the defi nitive accent can make is this: ko e tangata means “a man” but ko e tangata ́ means “the man”.") Logically this leaves us with a sequence ā´, which should be confirmed by an expert on the language. Meanwhile Wikipedia informs us that "Although the acute accent has been available on most personal computers from their early days onwards, when Tongan newspapers started to use computers around 1990 to produce their papers, they were unable to find, or failed to enter, the proper keystrokes, and it grew into a habit to put the accent after the vowel instead of on it: not á but a´. But as this distance seemed to be too big, a demand arose for Tongan fonts where the acute accent was shifted to the right, a position halfway in between the two extremes above. Most papers still follow this practice.". This is why I commented this in column J "Possible variant of ā´ ". I hope this clarifies the situation. Best, Meikal_______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp
Hello all. I am writing about the letter "ǎ"of the line 22 of this table : Google Sheets - create and edit spreadsheets online, for free. | | | Google Sheets - create and edit spreadsheets online, for free. Create a new spreadsheet and edit with others at the same time -- from your computer, phone or tablet. Get stuff... | | | The comment says that it can be attested. In Kirundi, we do use this glyph in schools because there are homographies. In attachment, the document I have shared in Drophox. On page 6, there are some examples of Kirundi words having this glyph. Best NKURUNZIZA Jean Paul TRAINER IN COMPUTING AND INTERNET POLICY ISOC BURUNDI : VICE PRESIDENT Réseau des Télécentres Communautaires du Burundi : Président Burundi Youth Training Centre : Secrétaire Général Skype : jpnkurunziz Facebook : http://www.facebook.com/jeanpaul.nkurunziza Twitter : @nkurunzizajp Linkedin : linkedin.com/in/jean-paul-nkurunziza-88217235 Tel : +257 79 981459 Le Mardi 12 décembre 2017 20h45, Bill Jouris <bill.jouris@insidethestack.com> a écrit : I am curious as to whether an acute accent after the vowel, even if only "halfway between the two extremes", would be considered indistinguishable from an apostrophe. (Just as the "turned comma" used in Hawai'ian is.) Which would make it a "punctuation mark", would it not? Bill Jouris Inside Products bill.jouris@insidethestack.com 831-659-8360 925-855-9512 (direct) From: Meikal Mumin <meikal.mumin@uni-koeln.de> To: Mats Dufberg <mats.dufberg@iis.se> Cc: Latin GP <LatinGP@icann.org> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 9:20 AM Subject: [Latingp] Tongan evidence for line 62 of Latin GP Code Points Dear Mats, in the shared Dropbox I created a folder Tongan, which contains a file called "tongan-lg.pdf". On pages 14-15 you can find further details about the orthography. Long vowels are represented in Tongan orthograpy by use of a Macron ("long vowels, as in màlò"). Meanwhile definiteness is marked by stress, which is is written in Tongan using a rising accent ´ following the vowel ("The fakamamafa pau or defi nitive accent falls on the fi nal vowel of a word and designates defi niteness, as in tangata ́ (the man). An example of the difference that the defi nitive accent can make is this: ko e tangata means “a man” but ko e tangata ́ means “the man”.") Logically this leaves us with a sequence ā´, which should be confirmed by an expert on the language. Meanwhile Wikipedia informs us that "Although the acute accent has been available on most personal computers from their early days onwards, when Tongan newspapers started to use computers around 1990 to produce their papers, they were unable to find, or failed to enter, the proper keystrokes, and it grew into a habit to put the accent after the vowel instead of on it: not á but a´. But as this distance seemed to be too big, a demand arose for Tongan fonts where the acute accent was shifted to the right, a position halfway in between the two extremes above. Most papers still follow this practice.". This is why I commented this in column J "Possible variant of ā´ ". I hope this clarifies the situation. Best, Meikal_______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp _______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp
Sorry for the misspelling in my previous message. The comment says it can't be attested and I think it can, taking into account the elements I provided. Best NKURUNZIZA Jean Paul TRAINER IN COMPUTING AND INTERNET POLICY ISOC BURUNDI : VICE PRESIDENT Réseau des Télécentres Communautaires du Burundi : Président Burundi Youth Training Centre : Secrétaire Général Skype : jpnkurunziz Facebook : http://www.facebook.com/jeanpaul.nkurunziza Twitter : @nkurunzizajp Linkedin : linkedin.com/in/jean-paul-nkurunziza-88217235 Tel : +257 79 981459 Le Mercredi 13 décembre 2017 8h52, Jean Paul NKURUNZIZA via Latingp <latingp@icann.org> a écrit : Hello all. I am writing about the letter "ǎ"of the line 22 of this table : Google Sheets - create and edit spreadsheets online, for free. | | | Google Sheets - create and edit spreadsheets online, for free. Create a new spreadsheet and edit with others at the same time -- from your computer, phone or tablet. Get stuff... | | | The comment says that it can be attested. In Kirundi, we do use this glyph in schools because there are homographies. In attachment, the document I have shared in Drophox. On page 6, there are some examples of Kirundi words having this glyph. Best NKURUNZIZA Jean Paul TRAINER IN COMPUTING AND INTERNET POLICY ISOC BURUNDI : VICE PRESIDENT Réseau des Télécentres Communautaires du Burundi : Président Burundi Youth Training Centre : Secrétaire Général Skype : jpnkurunziz Facebook : http://www.facebook.com/jeanpaul.nkurunziza Twitter : @nkurunzizajp Linkedin : linkedin.com/in/jean-paul-nkurunziza-88217235 Tel : +257 79 981459 Le Mardi 12 décembre 2017 20h45, Bill Jouris <bill.jouris@insidethestack.com> a écrit : I am curious as to whether an acute accent after the vowel, even if only "halfway between the two extremes", would be considered indistinguishable from an apostrophe. (Just as the "turned comma" used in Hawai'ian is.) Which would make it a "punctuation mark", would it not? Bill Jouris Inside Products bill.jouris@insidethestack.com 831-659-8360 925-855-9512 (direct) From: Meikal Mumin <meikal.mumin@uni-koeln.de> To: Mats Dufberg <mats.dufberg@iis.se> Cc: Latin GP <LatinGP@icann.org> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 9:20 AM Subject: [Latingp] Tongan evidence for line 62 of Latin GP Code Points Dear Mats, in the shared Dropbox I created a folder Tongan, which contains a file called "tongan-lg.pdf". On pages 14-15 you can find further details about the orthography. Long vowels are represented in Tongan orthograpy by use of a Macron ("long vowels, as in màlò"). Meanwhile definiteness is marked by stress, which is is written in Tongan using a rising accent ´ following the vowel ("The fakamamafa pau or defi nitive accent falls on the fi nal vowel of a word and designates defi niteness, as in tangata ́ (the man). An example of the difference that the defi nitive accent can make is this: ko e tangata means “a man” but ko e tangata ́ means “the man”.") Logically this leaves us with a sequence ā´, which should be confirmed by an expert on the language. Meanwhile Wikipedia informs us that "Although the acute accent has been available on most personal computers from their early days onwards, when Tongan newspapers started to use computers around 1990 to produce their papers, they were unable to find, or failed to enter, the proper keystrokes, and it grew into a habit to put the accent after the vowel instead of on it: not á but a´. But as this distance seemed to be too big, a demand arose for Tongan fonts where the acute accent was shifted to the right, a position halfway in between the two extremes above. Most papers still follow this practice.". This is why I commented this in column J "Possible variant of ā´ ". I hope this clarifies the situation. Best, Meikal_______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp _______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp _______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp
participants (4)
-
Bill Jouris -
Jean Paul NKURUNZIZA -
Mats Dufberg -
Meikal Mumin