> Hi Thomas,
>
> I must admit that your answers are increasing my confusion rather than
> reducing them.
>> Who is going to organize and operate something like www.hotels.nyc
>> <http://www.hotels.nyc> are great questions. I know the hotel trade
>> association here would be pleased (will demand it). On the other
>> hand, if we auction it off, we might get needed funds for civic
>> education on using the net (we are chartered by New York State as a
>> not-for-profit education organization).

> So... the intent is that the excess revenue anticipated will be funneled
> into education programs. Interesting... but as a non-profit, what are
> the contingencies for operating at a loss?

We've not see the RFP yet so it's hard to make projections based on suppositions. If ICANN is going to require a billion dollar operation or a N96 are needed bits before we can put a business plan. Our research has been informal, so the demand is unknown, but very positive, especially among the college age students. But the answer about the "contingencies for operating at a loss" is that we will be supported by our community or go out of business. Life sucks.

>> Allocation and ownership are tough questions to deal with. We're still
>> working on corporate governance, with a variety of possibilities
>> presented on this governance discussion page
>> <http://www.openplans.org/projects/campaign-for.nyc/board-of-directors>,
>> so as to add the requisite legitimacy to our effort, so we're not yet
>> in a position to make a decision like who gets www.hotels.nyc
>> <http://www.hotels.nyc>. But we've got our thinking beanies on. If you
>> have some thoughts, please contribute them to our wiki
>> <http://www.connectingnyc.openplans.org>.

> I would also note that there is significant opportunity for confusion if
> the method of allocating www.hotels.<city> differs significantly between
> the various city-based TLDs.
>
> How is this allocation done for .berlin? Why would the same approach not
> work across all city domains? Shouldn't there be some consistency for
> the Internet users of the world? Else, it's back to the search engines
> and all this effort for useful names is an expensive waste.

>> And if you have a billion $s marketing budget to create
>> www.nychotels.travel <http://www.nychotels.travel> as an intuitive
>> global destination for those interested in booking a nyc hotel room,
>> send me your paypal account and I'll ante up the $100.
> In what alternate universe does one believe that www.hotels.nyc would
> not require a massive marketing budget itself? It's not as if
> competition in that field isn't already plentiful and fierce.
>
> "Intuitive" is in the eye of the beholder, and highly subjective.

>> On the other hand, if the 400 year old entity that thinks of itself as
>> New York City (with 1/10th of 1% of the worlds population living on
>> 2/100,000ths of its surface) can get its act together and develop a
>> few dozen of these tourist names and present them to a global
>> audience, at the same time a .berlin and .paris are doing so, I bet
>> the marketing $s will be substantially less.

> (And somehow I suspect there are other cities with even greater
> populations and/or densities who do not share this need for a TLD. It's
> important to avoid "we _deserve_ this" mode.)

I don't recall saying that "we deserve this," but we do. Also, I'm unclear what you mean by the "other cities" comment. If you mean that some cities may not want or need a TLD, that might be quite true. I can speak with a reasonable amount of certainty for the apparent needs of New York City.

>> P.S. "But this urgent need ..." City TLDs are not urgent, any more
>> than consuming particular vitamins or minerals are to our diet. But
>> long term, the vitamin companies say, they help. However, if you're
>> into a competition and your competitors are taking vitamins and
>> minerals and other supplements (think .uk, .hk. .sg, and perhaps soon
>> .berlin and .paris) you'd better be thinking hard about sticking that
>> needle in your ass.
> Change "vitamins and minerals" to "steroids" and re-ask. Simply because
> others in the field are doing something dumb or wrong -- or even just
> ill-advised -- is not an excuse to follow suit.
>
> It is absolutely necessary to nail down the dirty details and find out
> who will pony up and what the rules will be, before spending money that
> might be better injected directly into the education programs you speak
> of. Civic pride alone won't -- can't -- make this fly.

Good advice. We're waiting on the ICANN for the RFP and some clue to those details. As to the education programs, they are predicated on the existence of the .nyc TLD and consist of education on using civic tools in civic spaces, with these "civic spaces" being .nyc domain names. So without .nyc, we're extinguished.

> And, if service to the Internet-using public outside NYC is at all a
> concern of this effort, consider having major policies harmonized
> between the existing applicants (.berlin and .paris) in possible
> anticipation of a (official or informal) CityNSO. Otherwise I have a
> hard time supporting it as a pure matter of At-Large public interest. If
> there are major differences between the different city TLD
> implementations, the intuition factor you speak of will be a myth at best.