NARALO 9th July Teleconference Summary
We're happy to tell you that the summary of the teleconference yesterday is now posted at: https://st.icann.org/naralo/index.cgi?meeting_summary_9_july_2007 -- Regards, Nick Ashton-Hart Director, At-Large ICANN PO Box 32160 London N4 2XY United Kingdom Main Tel: +44 (20) 8800-1011] USA Tel: +1 (202) 657-5460 Fax: +44 (20) 7681-3135 mobile: +44 (7774) 932798 email: nick.ashton-hart@icann.org Win IM: ashtonhart@hotmail.com / AIM/iSight: nashtonhart@mac.com / Skype: nashtonhart Online Bio: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashtonhart
Thank you for posting that, Nick, I was just thinking about the telephone conference last night (in those wasted hours between 3 - 4:00 AM) and something hit me as not making a lot of sense. Prior to the San Juan meeting, when we were discussing having a pre-formation one-on-one meeting in Vancouver/Yonkers/Montreal, we were told that there was plenty of money in the budget to do this and to still go to San Juan. Now we are being told that there isn't money in the budget to have gone to San Juan and then do further needed outreach in LA. WTF? What happened to it? As we only have about a dozen ALSs in the entire region, I would think that outreach would be as important at this time as formation. It just really seems like now that we have formed, the plug is being pulled. Or am I being paranoid? D Darlene A. Thompson Community Access Program Administrator Nunavut Department of Education/N-CAP c/o P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 Phone: (867) 975-6531 Fax: (867) 979-8870 dthompson@gov.nu.ca ________________________________ From: na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Nick Ashton-Hart Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 7:51 AM To: NA Discuss Subject: [NA-Discuss] NARALO 9th July Teleconference Summary We're happy to tell you that the summary of the teleconference yesterday is now posted at: https://st.icann.org/naralo/index.cgi?meeting_summary_9_july_2007 -- Regards, Nick Ashton-Hart Director, At-Large ICANN PO Box 32160 London N4 2XY United Kingdom Main Tel: +44 (20) 8800-1011] USA Tel: +1 (202) 657-5460 Fax: +44 (20) 7681-3135 mobile: +44 (7774) 932798 email: nick.ashton-hart@icann.org Win IM: ashtonhart@hotmail.com / AIM/iSight: nashtonhart@mac.com / Skype: nashtonhart Online Bio: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashtonhart
I dont think there is reason for paranoia, but there is something inconsistent. Also I think we have recieved different messages from different sources. My recollection is very much the same as yours with regard to what we were told. Also, there were additional communications regarding the policy of how many meetings per region, and the exception of having two meetings in a row in the same region, and that we should not be penalized for something was to the convenience of the organization (ICANN). Do we all need to travel and be at every event, clearly not. However, I am told that other regions had travel for multiple meetings in the formation of their RALO. I am not one to foment anything on the basis of such comparisons, but this will need to be discussed at a higher level. The best solution would be for the ALAC to control its funds directly. Let each RALO make its budget and justify it to the ALAC, with a fairly even allocation between them for projects meaningful to the RALO and to ALAC. (And a general fund for joint work between all RALOs and ALAC, such as summit, etc) I am sure that there can be effective and efficient use of funds with much less overhead. I believe also that by working in concert we can come up with additional resources. And lots of us know how to stretch a dime! I was a bit insulted to hear statement as to how much of the budget is allocated to At Large. I dont think that is the relevant issue. The issue is what is done with the resources and how it serves At large, which is "everybody"... and if we want this concept of "everybody" to be more than a fiction, then significant outreach momentum will need to be maintained in all regions. We are here engaged in public service and should not be treated like children. I have not articulated this as a formal argument weighing pros and cons, but I do think the issue bears consideration. I would like this taken up at some point in the near future, On 7/10/07, Thompson, Darlene <DThompson@gov.nu.ca> wrote:
Thank you for posting that, Nick,
I was just thinking about the telephone conference last night (in those wasted hours between 3 – 4:00 AM) and something hit me as not making a lot of sense. Prior to the San Juan meeting, when we were discussing having a pre-formation one-on-one meeting in Vancouver/Yonkers/Montreal, we were told that there was plenty of money in the budget to do this and to still go to San Juan. Now we are being told that there isn't money in the budget to have gone to San Juan and then do further needed outreach in LA. WTF? What happened to it? As we only have about a dozen ALSs in the entire region, I would think that outreach would be as important at this time as formation. It just really seems like now that we have formed, the plug is being pulled.
Or am I being paranoid?
D
Darlene A. Thompson
Community Access Program Administrator
Nunavut Department of Education/N-CAP
c/o P.O. Box 1000, Station 910
Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0
Phone: (867) 975-6531
Fax: (867) 979-8870
dthompson@gov.nu.ca
Michael, I'm willing to take up the issue of funding. In general terms, the civil society organizations that fall under the rubric of the ALAC have an overall budget allocation of $760,000 (per the ICANN budget figures). By contrast, the civil society organizations that operate under the NCUC umbrella have a budget allocation of $0. As is to be expected, this gross inequity is a legitimate source of concern to those that have been long-time legitimate contributors to the ICANN policy development process that are not the recipients of ICANN's largesse. They are the people that have actively participated in Working Groups thrashing out their positions in a combative policy development environment. They are the people that have joined Task Forces, that have engaged in research, that have done far more than merely "raising an issue", and they don't get a dime. These groups have learned to get their work done on-line without the benefit of travel funding and have often had to participate in ICANN plenaries on a remote basis. ICANN is not a cash cow that is here to be milked by every group that thinks that it will require a face-to-face meeting. ICANN will reasonably provide for intersessional events (such as the GNSO Amsterdam policy session) when there is ample justification (as in clear progress being made in a Working Group environment that could subsequently benefit from a face-to-face hashing out of issues), but frankly, what is the justification for giving one group more than three quarters of a million dollars while those more deserving (based on the merits of their demonstrated accomplishments) get nothing? I have seen a number of open working groups formed recently, and yet participation by ALSs has been virtually non-existent. Evidence of work-product will convince me that the current allocations are being well-spent.... but so far I see nothing to justify ALAC receipt of such funds while the cupboards of others go bare. regards, Danny ISOC-NY member NCUC --- Michael Maranda <mmaranda@afcn.org> wrote:
I dont think there is reason for paranoia, but there is something inconsistent. Also I think we have recieved different messages from different sources. My recollection is very much the same as yours with regard to what we were told. Also, there were additional communications regarding the policy of how many meetings per region, and the exception of having two meetings in a row in the same region, and that we should not be penalized for something was to the convenience of the organization (ICANN).
Do we all need to travel and be at every event, clearly not. However, I am told that other regions had travel for multiple meetings in the formation of their RALO. I am not one to foment anything on the basis of such comparisons, but this will need to be discussed at a higher level.
The best solution would be for the ALAC to control its funds directly.
Let each RALO make its budget and justify it to the ALAC, with a fairly even allocation between them for projects meaningful to the RALO and to ALAC. (And a general fund for joint work between all RALOs and ALAC, such as summit, etc)
I am sure that there can be effective and efficient use of funds with much less overhead.
I believe also that by working in concert we can come up with additional resources.
And lots of us know how to stretch a dime!
I was a bit insulted to hear statement as to how much of the budget is allocated to At Large. I dont think that is the relevant issue. The issue is what is done with the resources and how it serves At large, which is "everybody"... and if we want this concept of "everybody" to be more than a fiction, then significant outreach momentum will need to be maintained in all regions.
We are here engaged in public service and should not be treated like children.
I have not articulated this as a formal argument weighing pros and cons, but I do think the issue bears consideration. I would like this taken up at some point in the near future,
On 7/10/07, Thompson, Darlene <DThompson@gov.nu.ca> wrote:
Thank you for posting that, Nick,
I was just thinking about the telephone conference
last night (in those
wasted hours between 3 4:00 AM) and something hit me as not making a lot of sense. Prior to the San Juan meeting, when we were discussing having a pre-formation one-on-one meeting in Vancouver/Yonkers/Montreal, we were told that there was plenty of money in the budget to do this and to still go to San Juan. Now we are being told that there isn't money in the budget to have gone to San Juan and then do further needed outreach in LA. WTF? What happened to it? As we only have about a dozen ALSs in the entire region, I would think that outreach would be as important at this time as formation. It just really seems like now that we have formed, the plug is being pulled.
Or am I being paranoid?
D
Darlene A. Thompson
Community Access Program Administrator
Nunavut Department of Education/N-CAP
c/o P.O. Box 1000, Station 910
Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0
Phone: (867) 975-6531
Fax: (867) 979-8870
dthompson@gov.nu.ca
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Darlene, I'm afraid there must be a misunderstanding here. I never said that there was 'plenty of money' to have two meetings at ICANN meetings for the same region back-to-back. I would never say that because it is absolutely not the case. Having a pre-meeting to form a RALO was something money was available for because every other region had had one or more meetings in order to form their RALOs. These are two entirely different things. There has not ever been money for a single region to have two GAs back-to-back. On 10 Jul 2007, at 13:42, Thompson, Darlene wrote:
Thank you for posting that, Nick,
I was just thinking about the telephone conference last night (in those wasted hours between 3 – 4:00 AM) and something hit me as not making a lot of sense. Prior to the San Juan meeting, when we were discussing having a pre-formation one-on-one meeting in Vancouver/ Yonkers/Montreal, we were told that there was plenty of money in the budget to do this and to still go to San Juan. Now we are being told that there isn’t money in the budget to have gone to San Juan and then do further needed outreach in LA. WTF? What happened to it? As we only have about a dozen ALSs in the entire region, I would think that outreach would be as important at this time as formation. It just really seems like now that we have formed, the plug is being pulled.
Or am I being paranoid?
D
Darlene A. Thompson
Community Access Program Administrator
Nunavut Department of Education/N-CAP
c/o P.O. Box 1000, Station 910
Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0
Phone: (867) 975-6531
Fax: (867) 979-8870
dthompson@gov.nu.ca
From: na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:na-discuss- bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Nick Ashton-Hart Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 7:51 AM To: NA Discuss Subject: [NA-Discuss] NARALO 9th July Teleconference Summary
We're happy to tell you that the summary of the teleconference yesterday is now posted at:
https://st.icann.org/naralo/index.cgi?meeting_summary_9_july_2007
-- Regards,
Nick Ashton-Hart Director, At-Large
ICANN
PO Box 32160 London N4 2XY United Kingdom Main Tel: +44 (20) 8800-1011]
USA Tel: +1 (202) 657-5460
Fax: +44 (20) 7681-3135 mobile: +44 (7774) 932798 email: nick.ashton-hart@icann.org Win IM: ashtonhart@hotmail.com / AIM/iSight: nashtonhart@mac.com / Skype: nashtonhart
Online Bio: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashtonhart
Ahhhhhhhh... So, if we saved ICANN the money by not having one (or more) face-to-face meetings for formation and ours chose to save this money for outreach and future planning, then why can this pot not be reallocated? Obviously the money is there. Espcially since ICANN has no meeting set up for NA for next fiscal. D Darlene A. Thompson Community Access Program Administrator Nunavut Department of Education/N-CAP c/o P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 Phone: (867) 975-6531 Fax: (867) 979-8870 dthompson@gov.nu.ca ________________________________ From: Nick Ashton-Hart [mailto:nick.ashton-hart@icann.org] Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 11:04 AM To: Thompson, Darlene Cc: NA Discuss Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] NARALO 9th July Teleconference Summary Darlene, I'm afraid there must be a misunderstanding here. I never said that there was 'plenty of money' to have two meetings at ICANN meetings for the same region back-to-back. I would never say that because it is absolutely not the case. Having a pre-meeting to form a RALO was something money was available for because every other region had had one or more meetings in order to form their RALOs. These are two entirely different things. There has not ever been money for a single region to have two GAs back-to-back. On 10 Jul 2007, at 13:42, Thompson, Darlene wrote: Thank you for posting that, Nick, I was just thinking about the telephone conference last night (in those wasted hours between 3 - 4:00 AM) and something hit me as not making a lot of sense. Prior to the San Juan meeting, when we were discussing having a pre-formation one-on-one meeting in Vancouver/Yonkers/Montreal, we were told that there was plenty of money in the budget to do this and to still go to San Juan. Now we are being told that there isn't money in the budget to have gone to San Juan and then do further needed outreach in LA. WTF? What happened to it? As we only have about a dozen ALSs in the entire region, I would think that outreach would be as important at this time as formation. It just really seems like now that we have formed, the plug is being pulled. Or am I being paranoid? D Community Access Program Administrator Department of Education/N-CAP Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 Fax: (867) 979-8870
Darlene, the money isn't there - a new budget year started 1 July. We have to live within the means we have available to us. As I told you, we could find a way to have a regional meeting at some point mid-way-ish between the San Juan meeting and the next NA meeting. We can also have an outreach event which brings some of you to the LA meeting. We could also have a telephonic meeting which allows those not at the LA meeting to attend virtually with those that are there. And of course I will once again be working to ensure that remote participation works for the other At-large related meetings and more of the workshops. On 10 Jul 2007, at 16:10, Thompson, Darlene wrote:
Ahhhhhhhh…
So, if we saved ICANN the money by not having one (or more) face-to- face meetings for formation and ours chose to save this money for outreach and future planning, then why can this pot not be reallocated? Obviously the money is there. Espcially since ICANN has no meeting set up for NA for next fiscal.
D
Darlene A. Thompson
Community Access Program Administrator
Nunavut Department of Education/N-CAP
c/o P.O. Box 1000, Station 910
Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0
Phone: (867) 975-6531
Fax: (867) 979-8870
dthompson@gov.nu.ca
From: Nick Ashton-Hart [mailto:nick.ashton-hart@icann.org] Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 11:04 AM To: Thompson, Darlene Cc: NA Discuss Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] NARALO 9th July Teleconference Summary
Darlene, I'm afraid there must be a misunderstanding here.
I never said that there was 'plenty of money' to have two meetings at ICANN meetings for the same region back-to-back. I would never say that because it is absolutely not the case.
Having a pre-meeting to form a RALO was something money was available for because every other region had had one or more meetings in order to form their RALOs.
These are two entirely different things.
There has not ever been money for a single region to have two GAs back-to-back.
On 10 Jul 2007, at 13:42, Thompson, Darlene wrote:
Thank you for posting that, Nick,
I was just thinking about the telephone conference last night (in those wasted hours between 3 – 4:00 AM) and something hit me as not making a lot of sense. Prior to the San Juan meeting, when we were discussing having a pre-formation one-on-one meeting in Vancouver/ Yonkers/Montreal, we were told that there was plenty of money in the budget to do this and to still go to San Juan. Now we are being told that there isn’t money in the budget to have gone to San Juan and then do further needed outreach in LA. WTF? What happened to it? As we only have about a dozen ALSs in the entire region, I would think that outreach would be as important at this time as formation. It just really seems like now that we have formed, the plug is being pulled.
Or am I being paranoid?
D
Community Access Program Administrator
Department of Education/N-CAP
Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0
Fax: (867) 979-8870
participants (4)
-
Danny Younger -
Michael Maranda -
Nick Ashton-Hart -
Thompson, Darlene