Danny:
When I look at the ALAC I see a group of people that> won't fight for at-large representation. I don't agree with you, into ALAC there are people who attempt to fight for the at large community, and every day in their places of residence make a lot of things for the end users interests. ALAC is only an advisory committee and must to work in relation with bylaws, so must be organic and respectfull with the rules imposed. I see a> bunch of Working Groups wherein nothing gets done. ALAC is a new structure after RALOS and is starting to work in a different way than before, is like a child when try to start to walk. But we are learning so fast. I> see a general discussion list where ALAC members from> most of the regions usually have absolutely nothing to> say on policy issues. It's true but this is caused by the participation policy of ICANN and the lack of budget. ICANN have to translate every document to every languajes, in order people of everywhere(users) knows about the ICANN reality. Many Als's around the world are NGO's without money to do that ICANN have to. the participation is essential in this organization, specially the participation of end users, wich is the group that pay and give the money for mantein the organization. I see a group yearly willing to> waste a million dollars of registrant monies (and with> their hand always out for even more funding). It's true, and need more, much more to achieved the participation. I don' t know if we need for ALAC committee, but we need more to translate documents, to improve the transmition of ideas to the end users. > > If you recall, ICANN shut down the Protocol Supporting> Organization because it had no continuing purpose as> an ICANN structure. I see no continuing purpose in> the ALAC. I don't agree again. we need (ICANN need) more participation and give importance to the At Large community and their representants in ALAC.> > The ALAC model is a failure that produces no> substantive policy recommendations. Every model would be improved. The community need to know in order to can participate and make proposals about policies. In an> evolutionary process, failures result in extinction. ALAC need more time, not much more, to became in a most important committee into ICANN. Today the bad or good participation is only for english speakers, there aren't participation for non english speakers, because they don't know what happen into the organization, and the ALs's haven't resources to translate or communicate this.> It's time for the ALAC to be replaced by a different> model. As I said before, every model could be improved> > You asked for my proposals... they have been public> for some time now -- see my proposal to establish a> Registrant Advisory Committee at> http://gnso.icann.org/mailing-lists/archives/ga-200709/msg01080.html> > I have assembled a team of eighteen individuals that> will be fleshing out this proposal. A domain name has> been registered for the project --> registrantadvisorycommittee.info> > Hosting was purchased yesterday. The website will be> up in a matter of days and consultations will then> commence. Sorry Danny, but you have a different vision, you can't see the same than end users. your solutions will be different and you speack english only, an your domain mane is a web in english, and you think with the (from) US english perspective, and Internet is not only for US. I can see this in your proposal in relation with JPA, the conclusion of this document show in a clear way your position, and I particularly disagree whit this. > > In ICANN's history, representative bodies have been> eliminated or replaced (one example is the DNSO> General Assembly that disappeared as a representative> unit in the wake of the 2002 Reform); I see no> compelling reason to waste more money on a> non-productive ALAC. again, is only your partial vision. you are a very important people into ICANN, because you have a long participation , but you aren't the only person into ICANN world> > Have a look at the SSAC -- at least they produce> substantive documents with research, findings and> recommendations. What does the ALAC produce other> than brief Statements that are the product of only > few minutes worth of discussion? come back to the same, we need participation, specially participation of the non english speakers, time and more founds.> > The ALAC doesn't serve the needs of the at-large> community. It never has. It was built as a playpen> to keep Civil Society occupied after At-Large> representational rights were taken away. the solution is more participation, ICANN have to improve the mechanisms of participation. In ALAC we are working for that.> > No amount of reform will change an institution in> which elected representatives rarely choose to> contribute in an online environment and almost never> choose to engage in meaningful policy work. The AT Large representtives, ALAC members by RALOs, are part of the society, are end users and also need to know, in much cases (the mayority around the world) they don't talk english. Sorry to be insistent but I'm convinced that I say.> > It is time for another model. Always is a good time to improve. but your words in a first mail were very innappropriated, talking the people understand, but talking in a polite way.> > best regards, the best for you> DannyMi contestacion estaba pensada para hacerla en espanol, pero prefiero que Ud la entienda, aunque reconozco mi mal ingles. gracias por su esfuerzo en tratar de entender. Todo es perfectible, tambien el modo con que Ud se expreso en su primer correo. Por eso le pido que la proxima vez se dirija con propiedad hacia personas que merecen el mismo respeto que Ud.. de nuevo gracias.
Carlos Dionisio Aguirre abogado - Sarmiento 71 - 4to. 18 Cordoba - Argentina - *54-351-424-2123 / 423-5423 www.sitioderecho.com.ar www.densi.com.ar > Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 10:56:37 -0700> From: dannyyounger@yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [At-Large] Comments on GNSO improvements> To: carlosaguirre62@hotmail.com; wendy@seltzer.com> CC: alac@atlarge-lists.icann.org> > Hello Carlos,> > When I look at the ALAC I see a group of people that> won't fight for at-large representation. I see a> bunch of Working Groups wherein nothing gets done. I> see a general discussion list where ALAC members from> most of the regions usually have absolutely nothing to> say on policy issues. I see a group yearly willing to> waste a million dollars of registrant monies (and with> their hand always out for even more funding).> > If you recall, ICANN shut down the Protocol Supporting> Organization because it had no continuing purpose as> an ICANN structure. I see no continuing purpose in> the ALAC.> > The ALAC model is a failure that produces no> substantive policy recommendations. In an> evolutionary process, failures result in extinction. > It's time for the ALAC to be replaced by a different> model.> > You asked for my proposals... they have been public> for some time now -- see my proposal to establish a> Registrant Advisory Committee at> http://gnso.icann.org/mailing-lists/archives/ga-200709/msg01080.html> > I have assembled a team of eighteen individuals that> will be fleshing out this proposal. A domain name has> been registered for the project --> registrantadvisorycommittee.info> > Hosting was purchased yesterday. The website will be> up in a matter of days and consultations will then> commence.> > In ICANN's history, representative bodies have been> eliminated or replaced (one example is the DNSO> General Assembly that disappeared as a representative> unit in the wake of the 2002 Reform); I see no> compelling reason to waste more money on a> non-productive ALAC. > > Have a look at the SSAC -- at least they produce> substantive documents with research, findings and> recommendations. What does the ALAC produce other> than brief Statements that are the product of only a> few minutes worth of discussion?> > The ALAC doesn't serve the needs of the at-large> community. It never has. It was built as a playpen> to keep Civil Society occupied after At-Large> representational rights were taken away. > > No amount of reform will change an institution in> which elected representatives rarely choose to> contribute in an online environment and almost never> choose to engage in meaningful policy work.> > It is time for another model. > > best regards,> Danny> > > > --- carlos aguirre <carlosaguirre62@hotmail.com>> wrote:> > > > > Danny: When I met you in LA, I thought that> > you were the best. Now I can see my mistake. Your> > comments are not constructive, I'm sure your> > comments have been made with some intentionality.> > I'm thinking that may be you are an element used by> > others (I don't Know who) to disqualify the ALAC's> > work, or.... you bought the ideas of who try to> > delete ALAC of the map. I worry so much, the> > possibility that one smart guy, only be a ..........> > You can say this in a better way, making a> > critic, and maybe in some points we can find> > coincidences but..... It is not the first> > time that you say how much useless is ALAC and their> > members, but what are you proposals?. please tell> > the people what are your true intentions and how you> > can give solutions to this, could be clear, could be> > honest. thank's and sorry for my bad english. > > Me gustaria usted pudiera entender mi idioma, por> > que de esta manera estariamos en igual posicion de> > mantener esta discucion. Lamentablemente mi ingles> > no es perfecto y por lo que se Ud. solo habla su> > lengua, es una pena que Ud. solo piense y hable en> > ingles estadounidense. Me gustaria verlo a Ud hacer> > sus "aportes" en espanol o en otro idioma diferente> > al ingles, are you able?. Carlos> > Dionisio Aguirre> > abogado - Sarmiento 71 - 4to. 18 Cordoba - Argentina> > -*54-351-424-2123 /> > 423-5423www.sitioderecho.com.arwww.densi.com.ar >> > Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 04:24:32 -0700> From:> > dannyyounger@yahoo.com> To: wendy@seltzer.com> CC:> > alac@atlarge-lists.icann.org> Subject: [At-Large]> > Comments on GNSO improvements> > Wendy,> > I agree> > with your assessment that this Statement> completely> > lacks substance. It offers no specific>> > counter-proposals to the BGC work-product. As a>> > document, it is almost as useless as the ALAC> > itself.> > What value is there in declaring "we do> > believe that> the Internet end-user’s voice must be> > included in the> new GNSO" without formulating a> > means by which this> may be accomplished?> > ... and> > then there are the comments that make one want> to> > vomit, such as, "Since as mentioned the At-Large>> > community has been actively engaged in developing> > and> implementing new approaches to a working group>> > modality for policy development, some of the>> > experiences we have had in that process may prove>> > salutary."> > The ALAC is absolutely clueless when> > it comes to> running a working group, and their WGs> > have been> abject failures -- asking the GNSO to> > consider ALAC> achievements in this area is> > laughable and makes the> ALAC look like fools and> > simpletons. I'm starting to> think that whoever> > penned this Statement is living in> some alternate> > universe where reality rarely intrudes.> > > If you> > ever needed proof that ALAC serves "no> continuing> > purpose in the ICANN structure", this> Statement> > would go a long way toward making that case.> > The> > Board is looking for real solutions to deal with>> > issues that have been plaguing the GNSO since the> > days> of the DNSO. This Statement offers up no real>> > solutions. The best thing that one can say about> > this> Statement is that if it were printed on toilet> > paper > it might ultimately serve some useful> > purpose.> > > >> >> ____________________________________________________________________________________>> > You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one> > month of Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost. >> > http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text5.com>> > > _______________________________________________>> > ALAC mailing list> ALAC@atlarge-lists.icann.org>> >> http://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/alac_atlarge-lists.icann.org>> > > At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org> >> _________________________________________________________________> > Ingresá ya a MSN Deportes y enterate de las últimas> > novedades del mundo deportivo.> > http://msn.foxsports.com/fslasc/> > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________> You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost. > http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text5.com _________________________________________________________________ Descargá ya gratis y viví la experiencia Windows Live. http://www.descubrewindowslive.com/latam/index.html