Sounds like you are referring to - outreach - something mention, I think as a key objective that ALS's and ALAC needs to be doing. In my opinion, there is much outreach still as - for the most part - most internet users have no idea that there is a space for them to learn about and participate in - the governance and policies of ICANN.. regards Robert On Sat, Jun 7, 2008 at 3:29 PM, Dominik Filipp <dominik.filipp@dsoft.sk> wrote:
Jacqueline,
This is just an idea to think over. Online surveys, when massively publicly announced, can be a very efficient means to collect large pattern of public opinions. I know there are countries where the Internet access is perhaps not that obvious as in developed countries; and I am not proposing to restrict the gathering of opinions solely to the surveys, there are also other means worth considering. But the Internet access is widely spread nowadays and covers a large part of the planet.
I hope we can both agree that online surveys would be a significant first step towards the public community. And they can be conducted on regional level by ALSes. Other approaches can be considered in parallel, no problem.
Dominik
-----Original Message----- From: alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Jacqueline A. Morris Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2008 9:01 PM To: At-Large Worldwide Subject: Re: [At-Large] ALAC and AtLarge and france at large
More problems than that - how do you propose that ALL users get a chance to participate? Web polls and such tools are not sufficient to reach the vast majority of users in the developing world, or do you want to continue to leave us out? Jacqueline Dominik Filipp wrote:
As a necessary prerequisite, assume that the at-large has a voting power. As I already elaborated on this a little on the GA, I see one possibility in establishing a quantifiable public input in form of online surveys, straw polls, polling booths, etc. accessible to everyone interesting in issues upon subscription/registration to a specific list and possibly some other basic verification mechanisms. Prior to public voting there will be some sufficient room for public deliberation and various discussions on issues similarly as it is now on the lists. This, however, opens some questions, for instance, how to consolidate the 'public result' (gathered after counting up the final public survey votes) when it is in contradiction with a significant or apparent fact
questioning the effectiveness of the public result. But I think this is not as impassable problem as it might seem at first glance and, in my opinion, can be overcome.
Dominik
-----Original Message----- From: Jeffrey A. Williams [mailto:jwkckid1@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 11:49 PM To: Dominik Filipp; Jacqueline Morris; dannyyounger@yahoo.com; aheineman@ntia.doc.gov Cc: At-Large Worldwide; alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca; bev@pcna.ca; icann-list@sorehands.com; BClist@bizconst.org; namecritic@blogs.pn; Brenbe@consumer.org; bfausett@internet.law.pro; CWallace@cygnacom.com;
carlton.samuels@uwimona.edu.jm; cheryl@hovtek.com.au; dannyyounger@yahoo.com; dave@farber.net; denise.michel@icann.org; derek@aa419.org; dpefeva@isoc.bg; Dominik Filipp; elisabeth.porteneuve@cetp.ipsl.fr; enoss@tucows.com; frederic.teboul@icann.org; ssene@ntia.doc.gov; cgomes@verisign.com; iza@anr.org; jam@jacquelinemorris.com; jefsey@club-internet.fr; jpalmer@american-webmasters.net; kp2007@friscotx.com; matthias.langenegger@icann.org; mike@palage.com; michele@blacknight.ie; Jeff.Neuman@neustar.us; jnevett@networksolutions.com; nick.ashton-hart@icann.org; Paul.Paray@CNA.COM; patrick@vande-walle.eu; twomey@icann.org; robert@privaterra.org; roberto@icann.org; ross@tucows.com; stacy.burnette@icann.org; sebastien.bachollet@isoc.fr; roessler@does-not-exist.org; vb@bertola.eu; wendy@seltzer.com; joly@punkcast.com Subject: Re: [At-Large] ALAC and AtLarge and france at large
Dominik and all,
The more important problem with the ALAC and the ALS'es is that of accountability and transparency. Not only too ICANN but unto themselves. Only 15 voting members in the
ALAC?! How is that possible? How is such legitimate to users? How is such accountable to users? Frankly, it isn't accountable, nor ligitimate/transparent. It is of course *possible* if those that have the control of the servers for list forums and other underpennings are not themselves honest, transparent, and ethically accountable.
If each user that is a participant of any ALS and/or the ALAC cannot
vote on any issue, there is little or no accountability. If any user that is a participant to any ALS or the ALAC cannot vote and freely participate on any ALS or ALAC forum uninhibited, there is little or no transparency nor accountability.
-----Original Message-----
From: Dominik Filipp <dominik.filipp@dsoft.sk> Sent: Jun 6, 2008 8:59 AM To: Jacqueline Morris <jam@jacquelinemorris.com>, dannyyounger@yahoo.com Cc: At-Large Worldwide <alac@atlarge-lists.icann.org> Subject: Re: [At-Large] ALAC and AtLarge and france at large
Jacqueline,
Danny is talking about principal things. The fact is that at-large in
its current status should be advocating the wide user community, which is over 99% of all people/bodies recognized as Internet stakeholders. The fact that this vast majority has no representative voting seats is simply unacceptable, dishonesting and a failure of the commitment given
to the public community. That is, every efforts not targeted this direction is just tacit collaboration in making up this cover-up and an
extension of the agony.
The fact that you have managed something in the air is, sorry, nearly
nothing in comparison to the great loss of real and representative voting power. I am sorry but without this all this are just toothless
toys for children playing in the sand. Jacqueline and some others, I don't diminish all the efforts and the sincerity you have invested into
it but realize that the basic priorities are upside down. I absolutely cannot understand how the ALAC and the ALS'es can accept such a subordinate and undignified position! Doing this is unfair and
unaccountable and just covering the real goals being pursued behind the
scenes. We know all what they are like. But have no courage to speak them out loudly. That's the tragedy of the at-large.
And the results? The ALAC was not even able to advocate its own position on domain tasting held previously. Is this a proper advisory
committee behavior? Isn't it funny? A committee that is first 'advised'
what it should advise? Just a masquerade.
And the classical bread and circuses. Nothing else yet.
That is my pretty honest opinion.
Dominik
-----Original Message----- From: alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:alac-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Jacqueline
Morris Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 4:49 PM To: dannyyounger@yahoo.com Cc: At-Large Worldwide Subject: Re: [At-Large] ALAC and AtLarge and france at large
Hey Danny I am not ashamed at all. We have successfully managed to get ICANN issues in the air in Trinidad and Tobago and in a large part of the Caribbean that wasn't involved at all, thanks to this current
structure.
I think you meant to refer to the earlier "part-global" elections, as
many many Internet users were left out. We went over this a lot a year ago. Those elections were not at all representative, IMO. So I think your structure was not good as I think it is intrinsically unfair to developing countries, and you think the current one is not good. Makes no sense fighting for a structure that doesn't exist, got scrapped and doesn't have support from at least half of the involved
users.
The logical thing is to work towards a structure that works for us both, and stop trying to beat a very very dead cow back to life. Jacqueline
On Fri, Jun 6, 2008 at 10:35 AM, Danny Younger <dannyyounger@yahoo.com> wrote:
It's pathetic, and an insult to every At-Large member that voted in
the earlier global elections. You should all be ashamed.
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