Derek and all, The privacy act took into account many various considerations in respect to criminal activity, database privacy, which Whois essentially is not withstanding. Criminal activity in respect to Domain registration and consequencial Whois related data has far more to do with lack of accuracy (read falsefying some registration information ) than it does with using privacy to protect the potential criminal activity. Conversly, lack of good privacy for registrants presupposes that all registrants are potential suspects in some criminal activity or may decide to become involved in same. This assumption is of course falaonious in nature and in fact as the vast majority of registrants are not now, nor are likely to become involved directly in criminal activity of any sort. These are indeed the most RELEVANT FACTS, which I hope and am sure are of the most and relevant interest to you Derek. -----Original Message-----
From: Derek Smythe <derek@aa419.org> Sent: May 3, 2008 1:14 PM To: Ross Rader <ross@tucows.com> Cc: "alac@atlarge-lists.icann.org" <alac@atlarge-lists.icann.org> Subject: Re: [At-Large] New CIRA Whois Policy Strikes Balance Between Privacy and Access
Ross,
I do not deal in fear mongering, I deal in practicalities and facts. As such, if there is anything I said that you considerer as such, please say which and I can gladly illustrate the point as having a basis. I am sure you could also get many examples of each from all who deals with abuse issues.
Much as we all would like to see privacy across all name spaces long term, if no checks and balances are in places before such implementation and the recognition of a basic fact that criminal elements would even more dearly love "privacy" than us normal law obedient registrants, we are only exacerbating abuse problems.
Derek
Ross Rader wrote:
Whois privacy for .ca names is nothing new. Implementation of this policy will simply standardize it across the namespace. There's simply no basis for your fear mongering.
--- Warm regards,
-Ross
Sent from my iPhone using my DomainDirect.com personalized mobile email. Ask me how it works!
On 3-May-08, at 2:47 PM, Derek Smythe <derek@aa419.org> wrote:
Sadly I have to agree with John.
Why, doesn't cxeibbltd.com just host a lovely domain, privacy protected and all!
That is until you search on the telephone number given on the contact page, 1-800-882-4036 and start digging deeper.
However, all is not bad. The privacy provider for the mentioned domain will most likely expose whois since they have a zero fraud tolerance and the Registrar as will cancel it.
There is a lesson to learn here: Checks and balances.
Many of these scammers' domains pass our hands regularly, I would like to say I live in the real world of the Internet.
However, what is CIRA's policy upon encountering a similar situation? If the responses are one of the stock standard: - DRP, who will pay for the procedures for all those lovely scam, spam, phish domains? - Law Enforcement, I can guarantee you once again the process will be flawed unless the RCP rapidly expands their forces overnight. - Court Order, which court in which country? - Will the company vs private registrant rule be enforced?
http://www.cira.ca/en/documents/2007/PRP-rant-agreementv1.7.pdf How do you promptly resolve an issue? Evidence of residence faxed is as far as your nearest DTP package. I can show you many ID's and employee cards published by all but the logos of the institutions they claim to represent. Snail mail for a phishing domain?
To spice up the mix, we just add a large known contingent of scammers and carders known to live on the Toronto area, some of who have made the headlines already recently.
I can show list upon list of registrants that turned out to be the same person, all determined by analyzing whois details. This information has been used to protect the all internet users time and again. Who will do this at CIRA where full whois info is not visible? How will they collaborate with other parties?
Pardon me if I sound cynical, but I have seen too many abuse reports ignored and too many ordinary internet users suffer the consequences.
I guess history will tell.
Regards
Derek
John Levine wrote:
kudos to CIRA for not only developing a privacy friendly WHOIS policy - but also implementing it.
Yes indeed. Every crook, scammer, phisher, and fraudster from St Johns to Victoria really appreciates it.
R's, John
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