Nov. 17, 2008
12:17 p.m.
Robert, I was interested as an internet user and professional from the region to join you and others for a dinner to meet Gamal "or Gemy is his nickname, whom is not the editor in chief of Al Distor Egyptian newspaper, he is the webmaster", i was interested to hear from him the problems of Egyptian bloggers and status of internet in Egypt but i did not hear anything related to that, this evening did not encourage me to participate in the video show beside another having another commitment at the same time. as i have expressed my opinion in an earlier email i don't think the ICANN meeting is the right fora for such discussions, am against web filtering and i support freedom of expression, but i guess we might lose track is the main focus to the internet status in Egypt was political, i have asked Gemy that night to ask his fellow bloggers to attend ICANN meeting to participate, learn and engage . I hope this incident dose not divert our attention from the main point which enhancing participation in ICANN meetings . Regards, Mohamed EL Bashir > > Robert et.al. Please see my intewrsaced comments to Robert's recent > posting below... > > CLO > >> Evan, > >> The issue of local user participation ended up being less then >> optimal due to a couple of reasons. > > <CLO> Many in the ICANN Community have agreed and complained about the > standard of Public and Remote participation at this Cairo meeting... > The matter of ICANN Meeting participation and our ( ALAC & At-Large's) > response to this issue will be a matter for discussion at the next > ALAC Meeting on the 25th > >> First, repeated requests for a room to host users was blocked - >> ewith the excuse given that rooms were not free. Of course that was >> not the case as the at large room was pretty well free when we were >> nothere. > > <CLO> Robert it would be so much easier if you Do NOT mix Apples and > Oranges=> please you are referring to a meeting of public interest > (Local Bloggers) that was hoping to have a meeting at the ICANN Venue > so that some of us could interface with them if we so desired... Your > request for a room for this activity was sent to Nick and I on the > 30th of October at 2300 hrs AEDST and in it (it is inserted below) you > indicate sponsorship from other entities to assist you in this > independent venture (well in as much as you were writing from the POV > of your role/ capacity as Project Director, Internet Freedom, Freedom > House... I do NOT see any outcome of this as a Public Participation in > ICANN Meetings matter... And the community should note that Nick > replied within a few hours and and you responded on the 31st that YOU > had not seen the video in question (see snip below) > >> Icann and some alac members expressed the vire informally that a >> local user event was not in "in the remit of at-large" any sensitive >> ssues might require that "a formal appology" be given to thee >> egyptian govt offcials. > > <CLO> My statements were in regards to conversation threads that were > critical of the host country of an ICANN meeting being conducted on > what I believe was an ICANN related ALAC in Cairo Chat space... that > was fixed at the time, to at least my satisfaction as Chair of the > ALAC and is unrelated to public participation and I stand by all of my > actions. > > When aked directly if the video could be shown at the enf of at alac > meeting cheryl stated to me that it was possible, only if it was > screen by her. I was not awarethat the chair has ever had vetting > righs on content > > <CLO> Cheryl stated that "to get into the very tight agenda time we > had for our ALAC meetings within the ICANN meeting the ALAC or at > least the ExCom would have needed to see the video to even consider > the logistics and planning at that time" YOU stated you had still not > seen it... that is ALL that I said regarding video footage being added > under and any other business in any meeting and you should note that > this is a procedural meeting matter The Chair has total control of the > Agenda of an ALAC meeting according to the ROP's and again this is NOT > a matter of Public Participation in th ICANN Meeting... > >> Local users did want to come, but with no possible ok from the chair >> or nick, an adhoc session had to be organized. With little adcance >> notice - of course few people came. Whilei was very disappointed >> with the turnout - it was good to see who did attend. It was mainly >> just the north americans. The rest , well did not seem interested. > > <CL0> Local users could have entered any publiuc ( open meeting > space in any part of the ICANN meeting in Cairo and specifically with > regards to a video veiwing where ALAC people and those interested in > ICANN could attend at the venue, you were able to organise a room, it > was mentioned/ advertised on our lists and chats and those who turned > up turned up +> AGAIN this is NOT a Public Participation in ICANN > meeting matter. > >> That alac and at large present did seem interested does not mean >> that local users did not want to meet us. Comments and blog posting >> in key MENA sites clearly show that the locals did want to meet us. > >> On the larger issue of engagement, namely virtual participation - I >> was shocked by the lack of effort undertaken. No dial-in, no open >> skype (voice) chat, no virtual questions. While in the past (san >> juan, la, etc) dial-ups did take place - nothing was done in cairo. >> Voip, is easy to do - and there is no excuse not to allow for >> virtual participation. In an age where we are more connected then >> ever, to do nothing - well, if not to care in the least. Indeed, a >> formal complaint should b e lodged and actions taken to make sure >> virtual participation - at alac meetings and other icann sessions is >> not just considered, but actually done in a way that is effective >> and participatory. Icann can do better on this, it must .. > > <CLO> All valid point and issues of great frustration to many of us > involved, THESE ARE matters we can discuss as an ALAC and as I said it > will be on our Agenda d=for the 25th (and your apologies are noted) > >> As for the public forum - indeed it seems that the "public >> participation director" seems to have had little effect in enhancing >> public participation at meetings. Can one not learn from the US >> election and use youtube to seek questions and comments and play >> them back at thr meeting. Sigh. > > <CLO> I am more than happy to organise a single topic call with the > ALAC/At-Large and the Public Participation Director to further this > important discussion (in fact I had started to discuss this with > Kieren in Cairo on the Saturday) > >> In summary, I think there is a bottom up interest for participation >> and dialogue - but these are resisted by management who prefer to >> control the agenda and keep desenting views to a min. What can be done > - well, comment and participate using other channels . Perhaps > interested actors would be well advised to submit a letter not to the > board, but instead to the incoming adminstration . > > <CLO> I couldn't agree more > > Robert > > <insert of request email on 30th October> > (resending - was in my queue, not sure if sent last night) > > Nick & Cheryl: > > I have been in touch over the last several weeks with Gemy Hood,who > is the Editor in Chief of El Dostor Daily News www.dostor.org and > quite actively involved in the Egyptian blogosphere. > > Thanks to funds I have been able to raise, Gemy and his colleagues, > have - in less then a week - been able to develop a short 20 min > video (arabic with english subtitles) that documents the issues & > challenges faced by Egyptian Internet users. I would like to propose > to show at at the ICANN meeting . > > .org (PIR) has graciously agreed to contribute 2,000 USD to sponsor a > small reception / outreach event so that participants of the ICANN > meeting can get a better understanding of the issues and challenges > faced by local internet users, and local users can learn about ways of > more actively participating at ICANN and Internet Governance processes. > > > If At-large is interested in collaborating in the session - then it > would be great. It would be a wonderful opportunity for us to better > know our local counterparts .. and encourage them to register as an > ALAC. We are missing participation from MENA region, and getting one > or more groups from Cairo to get involved would demonstrate that > At-Large is able to do outreach at meetings. > > > As for dates - Thursday Nov 6th between 4-5pm works well for Gemy and > others in the city. The next step, perhaps with both of your help - > is to book a space at the conference venue, and arrange logistics for > a reception. As I mentioned below, there is a small amount available > for hosting the reception. I would be more then open to have some ALAC > and/or ICANN staff at the start of the session if there's an interest > to do so > > > > regards > > Robert > --- > > > > R. Guerra > Project Director, Internet Freedom, Freedom House > 131 Connecticut Ave. NW Fl.6, Washington, DC 20036 > Direct: +1 202 747 7067, Main: +1 202 296 5101 > Mobile +1 202 569 1800, Fax: +1 202 293 2840 > Email: guerra@freedomhouse.org > > CONFIDENTIALITY CAUTION AND DISCLAIMER > > This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity > to which it is addressed and contains information that is privileged > and confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended > recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the > message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any > dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is > strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, > please notify me immediately at +1 (202) 296-5101 and delete the > original message. > > If you are the intended recipient of this message, we remind you that > electronic mail on the Internet may not be secure and that this > message was not and future messages will not be encrypted or otherwise > protected, unless specifically requested, in which case, special > arrangements will be made. > > <end Insert snip> > > Response from Nick... > > On 30-Oct-08, at 8:21 AM, Nick Ashton-Hart wrote: > > > Dear Robert: > > I?m preparing to leave now so there?s little I can do until tomorrow > at this point on this. I can say that it is VERY late in the day to > try and get any space at the conference venue for additional meetings > ? I will ask about it when I arrive. Is the video available somewhere > online so it can be seen? > > RG reply Fri 31/10/2008 12:51 AM > > Nick: > > I haven't seen the video yet. Will see it when I arrive tomorrow. > > Look forward to seeing you the rest of at-large this weekend. > > Robert > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > At-Large mailing list > At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org > http://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large_atlarge-lists.icann.org > > At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org > >