Do the Trump tariffs constitute DNS abuse?
Hi all, I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots. There is significant global chatter about one high-profile target of recent American tariffs, "Heard Island and McDonald Islands", inhabited only by penguins. While the memes and jokes resulting from this inclusion write themselves, one might ask: how did this Australian territory get included? Likewise, how did the tiny islands of St. Pierre and Miquelon off the coast of Newfoundland, part of France and thus the EU, get their own designation (and tariffs more than double those of the EU)? Numerous non-sovereign territories were listed. Why? Even though they are not countries, all of these listings have their own country-code top-level domains (ccTLDs in ICANN lingo). For Heard Island and McDonald Islands it's .hm which is not even used by the islands' administration (they use Antarctica .aq). I am not aware of any .hm domains in use by penguins, but any person in the world can have one for a flat $35/year <https://www.registry.hm/> -- not sure if these are resold by any ICANN registrars. Likewise St. Pierre and Miquelon's TLD is .pm, logically administered by AFNIC so it is a European domain even though it's physically in North America. This is similar to French Guiana (.gf) which is in South America, part of the EU, but subject to a LOWER US tariff rate than the EU. Perhaps it is the incorrect characterization of these domains as "country codes" that encouraged the US administration to just go down the list and assign tariff rates to (nearly) everything using its impeccably accurate trade-imbalance formula. I think the term "4-D chess" has been used to describe the strategy. It's certainly beyond me. Still, I wonder how folks in domain-name land feel about one of its primary resources being used this way. Should the IANA database come with a disclaimer that not all "country codes" are, indeed, countries? Is it misnamed, and, in this instance, is it being used in a way that will bring it disrepute? I look forward to the ccNSO's statement of grave concern in response to ALAC queries. -- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
Dear Evan, what proof do you have that they are actually using the top level domain list, itself derived from ISO3166? Perhaps they used the official UN geoscheme list of countries and territories, a copy of which you'll find on: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_territories_by_the_Unite... You'll agree that has nothing to do with Country Codes. Best, Olivier On 08/04/2025 09:17, Evan Leibovitch via At-Large wrote:
Hi all,
I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots.
There is significant global chatter about one high-profile target of recent American tariffs, "Heard Island and McDonald Islands", inhabited only by penguins. While the memes and jokes resulting from this inclusion write themselves, one might ask: how did this Australian territory get included? Likewise, how did the tiny islands of St. Pierre and Miquelon off the coast of Newfoundland, part of France and thus the EU, get their own designation (and tariffs more than double those of the EU)? Numerous non-sovereign territories were listed.
Why? Even though they are not countries, all of these listings have their own country-code top-level domains (ccTLDs in ICANN lingo). For Heard Island and McDonald Islands it's .hm which is not even used by the islands' administration (they use Antarctica .aq). I am not aware of any .hm domains in use by penguins, but any person in the world can have one for a flat $35/year <https://www.registry.hm/> -- not sure if these are resold by any ICANN registrars. Likewise St. Pierre and Miquelon's TLD is .pm, logically administered by AFNIC so it is a European domain even though it's physically in North America. This is similar to French Guiana (.gf) which is in South America, part of the EU, but subject to a LOWER US tariff rate than the EU.
Perhaps it is the incorrect characterization of these domains as "country codes" that encouraged the US administration to just go down the list and assign tariff rates to (nearly) everything using its impeccably accurate trade-imbalance formula. I think the term "4-D chess" has been used to describe the strategy. It's certainly beyond me.
Still, I wonder how folks in domain-name land feel about one of its primary resources being used this way. Should the IANA database come with a disclaimer that not all "country codes" are, indeed, countries? Is it misnamed, and, in this instance, is it being used in a way that will bring it disrepute?
I look forward to the ccNSO's statement of grave concern in response to ALAC queries.
-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
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There are many territories that have ISO codes that don't have ccTLDs. Bonaire, for instance. It is not in the US tariff list. I stand by my comment. - Evan On Tue, Apr 8, 2025 at 4:52 AM Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com> wrote:
Dear Evan,
what proof do you have that they are actually using the top level domain list, itself derived from ISO3166?
Perhaps they used the official UN geoscheme list of countries and territories, a copy of which you'll find on: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_territories_by_the_Unite...
You'll agree that has nothing to do with Country Codes. Best,
Olivier
On 08/04/2025 09:17, Evan Leibovitch via At-Large wrote:
Hi all,
I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots.
There is significant global chatter about one high-profile target of recent American tariffs, "Heard Island and McDonald Islands", inhabited only by penguins. While the memes and jokes resulting from this inclusion write themselves, one might ask: how did this Australian territory get included? Likewise, how did the tiny islands of St. Pierre and Miquelon off the coast of Newfoundland, part of France and thus the EU, get their own designation (and tariffs more than double those of the EU)? Numerous non-sovereign territories were listed.
Why? Even though they are not countries, all of these listings have their own country-code top-level domains (ccTLDs in ICANN lingo). For Heard Island and McDonald Islands it's .hm which is not even used by the islands' administration (they use Antarctica .aq). I am not aware of any .hm domains in use by penguins, but any person in the world can have one for a flat $35/year <https://www.registry.hm/> -- not sure if these are resold by any ICANN registrars. Likewise St. Pierre and Miquelon's TLD is .pm, logically administered by AFNIC so it is a European domain even though it's physically in North America. This is similar to French Guiana (.gf) which is in South America, part of the EU, but subject to a LOWER US tariff rate than the EU.
Perhaps it is the incorrect characterization of these domains as "country codes" that encouraged the US administration to just go down the list and assign tariff rates to (nearly) everything using its impeccably accurate trade-imbalance formula. I think the term "4-D chess" has been used to describe the strategy. It's certainly beyond me.
Still, I wonder how folks in domain-name land feel about one of its primary resources being used this way. Should the IANA database come with a disclaimer that not all "country codes" are, indeed, countries? Is it misnamed, and, in this instance, is it being used in a way that will bring it disrepute?
I look forward to the ccNSO's statement of grave concern in response to ALAC queries.
-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
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At-Large Official Site: http://atlarge.icann.org _______________________________________________ By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy) and the website Terms of Service (https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
On 08/04/2025 09:55, Evan Leibovitch via At-Large wrote:
There are many territories that have ISO codes that don't have ccTLDs. Bonaire, for instance. It is not in the US tariff list.
I stand by my comment.
From the gTLD Hosting Market spreadsheet in the latest HosterStats Registrars and Resellers report: Territory - cc - region - hosted domains - locally hosted -externally hosted - hosted on IPs Bonaire, Sint Eustatius and Saba bq LAC 0 0 0 18 St Pierre and Miquelon pm EUR 190 0 164 14 French Guiana gf EUR 35 30 2 35 The 'hosted on IPs' number is that hosted on IP addresses associated with the country codes. Some islands are grouped under a country code. Even though some countries may have relatively undeveloped web hosting infrastructure, they may have web developers and others who host some websites in other countries. Regards...jmcc
- Evan
On Tue, Apr 8, 2025 at 4:52 AM Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com <mailto:ocl@gih.com>> wrote:
__ Dear Evan,
what proof do you have that they are actually using the top level domain list, itself derived from ISO3166?
Perhaps they used the official UN geoscheme list of countries and territories, a copy of which you'll find on: https:// en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ List_of_countries_and_territories_by_the_United_Nations_geoscheme <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ List_of_countries_and_territories_by_the_United_Nations_geoscheme>
You'll agree that has nothing to do with Country Codes. Best,
Olivier
On 08/04/2025 09:17, Evan Leibovitch via At-Large wrote:
Hi all,
I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots.
There is significant global chatter about one high-profile target of recent American tariffs, "Heard Island and McDonald Islands", inhabited only by penguins. While the memes and jokes resulting from this inclusion write themselves, one might ask: how did this Australian territory get included? Likewise, how did the tiny islands of St. Pierre and Miquelon off the coast of Newfoundland, part of France and thus the EU, get their own designation (and tariffs more than double those of the EU)? Numerous non-sovereign territories were listed.
Why? Even though they are not countries, all of these listings have their own country-code top-level domains (ccTLDs in ICANN lingo). For Heard Island and McDonald Islands it's .hm which is not even used by the islands' administration (they use Antarctica .aq). I am not aware of any .hm domains in use by penguins, but any person in the world can have one for a flat $35/ year <https://www.registry.hm/> -- not sure if these are resold by any ICANN registrars. Likewise St. Pierre and Miquelon's TLD is .pm, logically administered by AFNIC so it is a European domain even though it's physically in North America. This is similar to French Guiana (.gf) which is in South America, part of the EU, but subject to a LOWER US tariff rate than the EU.
Perhaps it is the incorrect characterization of these domains as "country codes" that encouraged the US administration to just go down the list and assign tariff rates to (nearly) everything using its impeccably accurate trade-imbalance formula. I think the term "4-D chess" has been used to describe the strategy. It's certainly beyond me.
Still, I wonder how folks in domain-name land feel about one of its primary resources being used this way. Should the IANA database come with a disclaimer that not all "country codes" are, indeed, countries? Is it misnamed, and, in this instance, is it being used in a way that will bring it disrepute?
I look forward to the ccNSO's statement of grave concern in response to ALAC queries.
-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
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-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
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Dear All, Evan: I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots. Elisabeth: How do you know what is the mainstream media? I do not know. It happens scarcely if ever that people try to find sources and purpose of just anything quoted as "the proof". It is the main difficulty nowadays. The initial ISO3166:1974 have been put together for the purpose of delivery of goods in the World, so just all interested parties have unambiguous method to solve the same problem. Including countries with territories in various continents. Many countries existing in 1970s, Member Bodies to the ISO, have been involved. The International Organizations collaborating to this work, were: Customs Co-operation Council (CCC), International Telegraph and Telephone Consultative Committee (CCITT), United Nations Economic Commission for Europe (ECE), Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations (FAO), International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), International Air Transport Association (IATA), International Chamber of Commerce (ICC), International Chamber of Shipping (ICs), International Federation of Library Associations (IFLA), International Labour Office (ILO), International Telecommunication Union (ITU), International Union of Railways (UIC), United Nations Organization (UN), United Nations Conference on Trade and Development (UNCTAD), Universal Postal Union (UPU), World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO), and World Health Organization (WHO). In short: today you have the ISO3166 country codes as a database, and you can see country names in official UN languages, as well as subdivision names. It is the official source, kept up to date. https://www.iso.org/iso-3166-country-codes.html Go to "How can I access ISO 3166?" section and Online Browsing Platform. Enjoy! Elisabeth Le 08/04/2025 à 10:52, Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via At-Large a écrit :
Dear Evan,
what proof do you have that they are actually using the top level domain list, itself derived from ISO3166?
Perhaps they used the official UN geoscheme list of countries and territories, a copy of which you'll find on: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_territories_by_the_Unite...
You'll agree that has nothing to do with Country Codes. Best,
Olivier
On 08/04/2025 09:17, Evan Leibovitch via At-Large wrote:
Hi all,
I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots.
There is significant global chatter about one high-profile target of recent American tariffs, "Heard Island and McDonald Islands", inhabited only by penguins. While the memes and jokes resulting from this inclusion write themselves, one might ask: how did this Australian territory get included? Likewise, how did the tiny islands of St. Pierre and Miquelon off the coast of Newfoundland, part of France and thus the EU, get their own designation (and tariffs more than double those of the EU)? Numerous non-sovereign territories were listed.
Why? Even though they are not countries, all of these listings have their own country-code top-level domains (ccTLDs in ICANN lingo). For Heard Island and McDonald Islands it's .hm which is not even used by the islands' administration (they use Antarctica .aq). I am not aware of any .hm domains in use by penguins, but any person in the world can have one for a flat $35/year <https://www.registry.hm/> -- not sure if these are resold by any ICANN registrars. Likewise St. Pierre and Miquelon's TLD is .pm, logically administered by AFNIC so it is a European domain even though it's physically in North America. This is similar to French Guiana (.gf) which is in South America, part of the EU, but subject to a LOWER US tariff rate than the EU.
Perhaps it is the incorrect characterization of these domains as "country codes" that encouraged the US administration to just go down the list and assign tariff rates to (nearly) everything using its impeccably accurate trade-imbalance formula. I think the term "4-D chess" has been used to describe the strategy. It's certainly beyond me.
Still, I wonder how folks in domain-name land feel about one of its primary resources being used this way. Should the IANA database come with a disclaimer that not all "country codes" are, indeed, countries? Is it misnamed, and, in this instance, is it being used in a way that will bring it disrepute?
I look forward to the ccNSO's statement of grave concern in response to ALAC queries.
-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
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Isn't it possible that the countries who control these territories (and others) could use them as a product origin to avoid tariffs? If so then maybe not so silly, just consistent with their goals -- the goals might be thought silly but not the inclusion of these territories. On April 8, 2025 at 04:17 at-large@icann.org (Evan Leibovitch via At-Large) wrote:
Hi all,
I'm surprised that nobody -- here or in the mainstream media -- has connected the dots.
There is significant global chatter about one high-profile target of recent American tariffs, "Heard Island and McDonald Islands", inhabited only by penguins. While the memes and jokes resulting from this inclusion write themselves, one might ask: how did this Australian territory get included? Likewise, how did the tiny islands of St. Pierre and Miquelon off the coast of Newfoundland, part of France and thus the EU, get their own designation (and tariffs more than double those of the EU)? Numerous non-sovereign territories were listed.
Why? Even though they are not countries, all of these listings have their own country-code top-level domains (ccTLDs in ICANN lingo). For Heard Island and McDonald Islands it's .hm which is not even used by the islands' administration (they use Antarctica .aq). I am not aware of any .hm domains in use by penguins, but any person in the world can have one for a flat $35/year -- not sure if these are resold by any ICANN registrars. Likewise St. Pierre and Miquelon's TLD is .pm, logically administered by AFNIC so it is a European domain even though it's physically in North America. This is similar to French Guiana (.gf) which is in South America, part of the EU, but subject to a LOWER US tariff rate than the EU.
Perhaps it is the incorrect characterization of these domains as "country codes" that encouraged the US administration to just go down the list and assign tariff rates to (nearly) everything using its impeccably accurate trade-imbalance formula. I think the term "4-D chess" has been used to describe the strategy. It's certainly beyond me.
Still, I wonder how folks in domain-name land feel about one of its primary resources being used this way. Should the IANA database come with a disclaimer that not all "country codes" are, indeed, countries? Is it misnamed, and, in this instance, is it being used in a way that will bring it disrepute?
I look forward to the ccNSO's statement of grave concern in response to ALAC queries.
-- Evan Leibovitch, Toronto Canada @evanleibovitch / @el56
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participants (5)
-
bzs＠theworld.com -
Evan Leibovitch -
John McCormac -
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond -
Porteneuve, Elisabeth (labo)