Dear Yrjö, dear colleagues, I do not know if silence is sign of agreement or disagreement, in Serbia we consider it like agreement. This mail does not mean that I disagree, I just want to be active ALS member. For me multistakeholderism is the most often used term in ICANN, CENTR, EuroDIG and other IG conferences and it means that we must prove that multistakeholderism is real principle and system that function in practice. Maybe this is enough for this email to explain my position or position of ALS where I am one of the member. As several founders of "Plug In" are or were people engaged in ICANN, CENTR and national ccTld Registry activities, we have recognized from the very beginning : - variety of internet and internet governance issues, - variety of internet users and their interest and their passive participation in internet governance and internet policy development - Long and hard work in order to become established, respected and equally treated organization Although our members are people who cover technical , educational, legal, entrepreneurship, IT, software business area of internet and IT technology, we are still trying to define and explain each other and to people what we are, what we are doing and what we want to be. Our main target were internet, education and promotion of basic internet values, but now after several years I would say that our target is promotion of multistakeholderism through our way of function, public events, discussions and conferences, all supported by services and activities which will bring new values for business, freelancer and private internet users and will support in financial and technical sense activities of our association. We see EURALO, ALSs and ICANN like the best place where we can find partners to reach our targets and values , and this is reason why I volunteer in this working group. In according with all mentioned , I see our taskforce and organization like united resources that can help us to find right topics, right steps, right activities and right people and position on global , regional and local level, and my position looks to me like very close wit Yrjo. I will finish with this for now. If some words, phrases or terms are not used in correct way, please forgive me, English is not my native language. Kind regards Nenad From: euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Yrjö Länsipuro Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 16:33 To: ICANN At-Large Staff; EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement Subject: Re: [euralo-tf-als-engagement] REMINDER DOOODLE / EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement Dear members of the Task Force, A few thoughts on our task: 1) It is self-evident that without active ALS's, EURALO (like other RALOs and At Large itself) would be just an empty shell. The credibility of ALAC/At Large as "the primary organizational home within ICANN for individual Internet users" hinges on whether our voice is emanating from the grassroots or just from a club of "usual suspects". 2) As we heard from Wolf at the EURALO call (July 26), earlier attempts at enhancing the grassroots engagement have been resisted by some ALS's as bureaucratic meddling from EURALO's side. As unjustified as such criticism may be, now we have to make absolutely sure that our efforts will not be seen in such light, and don't meet the same fate. 3) If one looks at the EURALO ALS list (https://atlarge.icann.org/alses/euralo), two facts jump out. First, the great diversity of the ALS's as to their nature and areas of interest. Some cover a broad spectrum of internet and information society issues. Some are interested in a more narrow segment among them. Some are NGO's engaged in other fields that have joined the At Large because of the importance of the internet in their core activities. Thus, their engagement in At Large varies greatly in relevance and subject matter interest from one ALS to the next. Thus, one size does not fit all. ( The other salient feature is EURALO's lopsided geography, especially the absence of ALS's in some parts of Europe. That is a separate problem, but our work may also contribute to solving it) 4) Enhancing the measurable activity level of ALS's is not an end in itself. Statistics aside, we are first of all interested in their activities that support the main role of At Large/ALAC "to consider and provide advice on the activities of ICANN, insofar as they relate to the interests of individual Internet users". Thus, all potential expertise "hidden" in the ALS's should be discovered and leveraged in preparing ALAC advice on ICANN activities. This would relieve the workload of those few who now do most of the drafting. Here, the diversity and different fields of specialization of ALS's could actually be a great asset. 5) An ALS can play an important role as a component of the multistakeholder setup at the national level and even as the initiator for national-level multistakeholder cooperation. To what extent this actually happens, varies from country to country, with have different traditions of communications among different sectors of the society, but the potential for improvement seems to be there. Like charity, multistakeholderism starts at home. The engagement of ALS´s in national multistakeholder cooperation should be actively promoted by EURALO, ie. by facilitating their contacts with other national level stakeholders active in ICANN. (The table prepared by Oksana is a good beginning for mapping the situation in various countries) 6) In my view, the Task Force should focus on (1) how to encourage the participation of fresh expert resources from the ALS's, according to their area of specialization, in the development of ALAC advice to ICANN's policy development processes and (2) how to encourage ALS's to play an active part in the multistakeholder processes on the national level. Looking forward to your thoughts and comments, and to our first call this coming week. If you haven't yet answered the Doodle, please so so asap so that we can fix the day and time of the call. Best, Yrjö _____ From: euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org <euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of ICANN At-Large Staff <staff@atlarge.icann.org> Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 4:25 PM To: EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement Subject: [euralo-tf-als-engagement] REMINDER DOOODLE / EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement Dear All, Further to the EURALO call on Tuesday 26 July, please complete the attached Doodle poll to schedule the first call of the EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement. <http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6> http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6 <http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6> <http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6> Doodle: EURALO ALS Engagement TF doodle.com Doodle radically simplifies the process of scheduling events, meetings, appointments, etc. Herding cats gets 2x faster with Doodle. For free! (time zone enabled) Wiki workspace: https://community.icann.org/x/dAZ1Aw Thank you. Kind regards, Gisella From: Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com> Date: Wednesday, 27 July 2016 at 18:22 To: Yrjö Länsipuro <yrjo_lansipuro@hotmail.com>, "wolf.ludwig@comunica-ch.net" <wolf.ludwig@comunica-ch.net>, Discussion for At-Large Europe <euro-discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org>, At-Large Staff <staff@atlarge.icann.org> Subject: Re: Fw: [EURO-Discuss] REMINDER: Meeting Invitation: EURALO Monthly Call on Tuesday, 26 July 2016 at 18:00 UTC Hello all, Yrjö has spoken to us about his plan for the Task Force and issued a call for members. If you are interested in At-Large Structure Engagement in Europe, including the engagement of your At-Large Structure, then may I suggest this would be a perfect working group to join. Not too much work, but the work that is undertaken would be really helpful to improve the engagement of At-Large Structures in the EURALO region. You can email Yrjö (CC'ed) & At-Large staff (or me) to get registered in this new task force. Kindest regards, Olivier On 26/07/2016 14:21, Yrjö Länsipuro wrote: Hi all, I would like to add to the agenda an item about the Task Force on ALS Engagement, for which I was made the chair of in absentia at the GA in Helsinki (it clashed with a NomCom meeting, where I had to be). I would like to have a short initial discussion today to prepare the ground for the first meeting of this task force as soon as possible, taking into account the holiday period. Best, Yrjö _____ From: <mailto:euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org <mailto:euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> <euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of ICANN At-Large Staff <mailto:staff@atlarge.icann.org> <staff@atlarge.icann.org> Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 1:00 PM To: Discussion for At-Large Europe Cc: Lars Hoffmann; Michael Yakushev; Jean-Jacques Sahel; Nick Thorne Subject: [EURO-Discuss] REMINDER: Meeting Invitation: EURALO Monthly Call on Tuesday, 26 July 2016 at 18:00 UTC If you require a dial-out please contact At-Large staff at staff@atlarge.icann.org with your preferred number. Please remember that it is now possible to connect your audio via the AC room, without using your telephone. You need a stable internet connection. If you would like a reminder of how to connect please let staff know. Dear All, The next EURALO Monthly Call is scheduled for Tuesday, 26 July 2016 at 18:00 UTC (20:00 CEST). The agenda (to be updated) and call details are available at: https://community.icann.org/x/hwObAw Adobe Connect room: http://icann.adobeconnect.com/euralo Conference ID: English: 1638 Dial-in numbers: http://adigo.com/icann/ EURALO Work space: https://community.icann.org/x/K5Qi If you require a dial-out please contact At-Large staff at: staff@atlarge.icann.org Thank you. Regards, Heidi Ullrich, Silvia Vivanco, Ariel Liang, Gisella Gruber, Nathalie Peregrine, Terri Agnew and Yeşim Nazlar ICANN Policy Staff in support of the At-Large Community E-mail: staff@atlarge.icann.org Website: atlarge.icann.org <https://atlarge.icann.org/> Facebook: facebook.com/icann <https://www.facebook.com/icannatlarge> atlarge <https://www.facebook.com/icannatlarge> Twitter: @ <https://twitter.com/ICANNAtLarge> ICANNAtLarge <https://twitter.com/ICANNAtLarge> unknown.png -- Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD http://www.gih.com/ocl.html

Thanks Nenad, that's exactly the kind of input we need. You are part of an organisation that appears to have worked out its priorities and see that participation in EURALO is an important priority. I am very excited by what you have said in how you do things at "Plug In". How do we convey this excitement in other At-Large Structures, so they feel equally excited in participating in At-Large? Kindest regards, Olivier On 03/08/2016 01:12, Nenad Marinkovic wrote:

Dear Yrjö, dear colleagues,

I do not know if silence is sign of agreement or disagreement, in Serbia we consider it like agreement. This mail does not mean that I disagree, I just want to be active ALS member.

For me multistakeholderism is the most often used term in ICANN, CENTR, EuroDIG and other IG conferences and it means that we must prove that multistakeholderism is real principle and system that function in practice. Maybe this is enough for this email to explain my position or position of ALS where I am one of the member.

As several founders of “Plug In” are or were people engaged in ICANN, CENTR and national ccTld Registry activities, we have recognized from the very beginning :

- variety of internet and internet governance issues,

- variety of internet users and their interest and their passive participation in internet governance and internet policy development

- Long and hard work in order to become established, respected and equally treated organization

Although our members are people who cover technical , educational, legal, entrepreneurship, IT, software business area of internet and IT technology, we are still trying to define and explain each other and to people what we are, what we are doing and what we want to be. Our main target were internet, education and promotion of basic internet values, but now after several years I would say that our target is promotion of multistakeholderism through our way of function, public events, discussions and conferences, all supported by services and activities which will bring new values for business, freelancer and private internet users and will support in financial and technical sense activities of our association.

We see EURALO, ALSs and ICANN like the best place where we can find partners to reach our targets and values , and this is reason why I volunteer in this working group.

In according with all mentioned , I see our taskforce and organization like united resources that can help us to find right topics, right steps, right activities and right people and position on global , regional and local level, and my position looks to me like very close wit Yrjo.

I will finish with this for now. If some words, phrases or terms are not used in correct way, please forgive me, English is not my native language.

Kind regards

Nenad

*From:*euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] *On Behalf Of *Yrjö Länsipuro *Sent:* Friday, July 29, 2016 16:33 *To:* ICANN At-Large Staff; EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement *Subject:* Re: [euralo-tf-als-engagement] REMINDER DOOODLE / EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement

Dear members of the Task Force,

A few thoughts on our task:

1) It is self-evident that without active ALS's, EURALO (like other RALOs and At Large itself) would be just an empty shell. The credibility of ALAC/At Large as "the primary organizational home within ICANN for individual Internet users" hinges on whether our voice is emanating from the grassroots or just from a club of "usual suspects".

2) As we heard from Wolf at the EURALO call (July 26), earlier attempts at enhancing the grassroots engagement have been resisted by some ALS's as bureaucratic meddling from EURALO's side. As unjustified as such criticism may be, now we have to make absolutely sure that our efforts will not be seen in such light, and don't meet the same fate.

3) If one looks at the EURALO ALS list (https://atlarge.icann.org/alses/euralo), two facts jump out. First, the *great diversity* of the ALS's as to their nature and areas of interest. Some cover a broad spectrum of internet and information society issues. Some are interested in a more narrow segment among them. Some are NGO's engaged in other fields that have joined the At Large because of the importance of the internet in their core activities. Thus, their engagement in At Large varies greatly in relevance and subject matter interest from one ALS to the next. Thus, *one size does not fit all*. ( The other salient feature is EURALO's lopsided geography, especially the absence of ALS's in some parts of Europe. That is a separate problem, but our work may also contribute to solving it)

4) Enhancing the measurable activity level of ALS's is not an end in itself. Statistics aside, we are first of all interested in their *activities that support the main role of At Large/ALAC* "to consider and provide advice on the activities of ICANN, insofar as they relate to the interests of individual Internet users". Thus, all potential expertise "hidden" in the ALS's should be discovered and leveraged in preparing ALAC advice on ICANN activities. This would relieve the workload of those few who now do most of the drafting. Here, the diversity and different fields of specialization of ALS's could actually be a great asset.

5) An ALS can play an important role as *a component of the multistakeholder setup at the national level* and even as the initiator for national-level multistakeholder cooperation. To what extent this actually happens, varies from country to country, with have different traditions of communications among different sectors of the society, but the potential for improvement seems to be there. Like charity, multistakeholderism starts at home. The engagement of ALS´s in national multistakeholder cooperation should be actively promoted by EURALO, ie. by facilitating their contacts with other national level stakeholders active in ICANN. (The table prepared by Oksana is a good beginning for mapping the situation in various countries)

*6) In my view, the Task Force should focus on (1) how to encourage the participation of fresh expert resources from the ALS's, according to their area of specialization, in the development of ALAC advice to ICANN's policy development processes and (2) how to encourage ALS's to play an active part in the multistakeholder processes on the national level.*

Looking forward to your thoughts and comments, and to our first call this coming week. If you haven't yet answered the Doodle, please so so asap so that we can fix the day and time of the call.

Best,

Yrjö

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*From:*euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org <euralo-tf-als-engagement-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of ICANN At-Large Staff <staff@atlarge.icann.org> *Sent:* Friday, July 29, 2016 4:25 PM *To:* EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement *Subject:* [euralo-tf-als-engagement] REMINDER DOOODLE / EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement

Dear All,

Further to the EURALO call on Tuesday 26 July, please complete the attached Doodle poll to schedule the *first call of the EURALO Task Force on ALS Engagement.*

http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6

<http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6>

Doodle: EURALO ALS Engagement TF <http://doodle.com/poll/m4aedidkckgku4w6>

doodle.com

Doodle radically simplifies the process of scheduling events, meetings, appointments, etc. Herding cats gets 2x faster with Doodle. For free!

/(time zone enabled)/

Wiki workspace:

https://community.icann.org/x/dAZ1Aw

Thank you.

Kind regards,

Gisella

*From: *Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com <mailto:ocl@gih.com>> *Date: *Wednesday, 27 July 2016 at 18:22 *To: *Yrjö Länsipuro <yrjo_lansipuro@hotmail.com <mailto:yrjo_lansipuro@hotmail.com>>, "wolf.ludwig@comunica-ch.net <mailto:wolf.ludwig@comunica-ch.net>" <wolf.ludwig@comunica-ch.net <mailto:wolf.ludwig@comunica-ch.net>>, Discussion for At-Large Europe <euro-discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org <mailto:euro-discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org>>, At-Large Staff <staff@atlarge.icann.org <mailto:staff@atlarge.icann.org>> *Subject: *Re: Fw: [EURO-Discuss] REMINDER: Meeting Invitation: EURALO Monthly Call on Tuesday, 26 July 2016 at 18:00 UTC

Hello all,

Yrjö has spoken to us about his plan for the Task Force and issued a call for members. If you are interested in At-Large Structure Engagement in Europe, including the engagement of your At-Large Structure, then may I suggest this would be a perfect working group to join. Not too much work, but the work that is undertaken would be really helpful to improve the engagement of At-Large Structures in the EURALO region. You can email Yrjö (CC'ed) & At-Large staff (or me) to get registered in this new task force. Kindest regards,

Olivier

On 26/07/2016 14:21, Yrjö Länsipuro wrote:

Hi all,

I would like to add to the agenda an item about the Task Force on ALS Engagement, for which I was made the chair of /in absentia /at the GA in Helsinki (it clashed with a NomCom meeting, where I had to be).

I would like to have a short initial discussion today to prepare the ground for the first meeting of this task force as soon as possible, taking into account the holiday period.

Best,

Yrjö

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*From:*euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org <mailto:euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> <euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> <mailto:euro-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of ICANN At-Large Staff <staff@atlarge.icann.org> <mailto:staff@atlarge.icann.org> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 26, 2016 1:00 PM *To:* Discussion for At-Large Europe *Cc:* Lars Hoffmann; Michael Yakushev; Jean-Jacques Sahel; Nick Thorne *Subject:* [EURO-Discuss] REMINDER: Meeting Invitation: EURALO Monthly Call on Tuesday, 26 July 2016 at 18:00 UTC

If you require a dial-out please contact At-Large staff at staff@atlarge.icann.org with your preferred number.

Please remember that it is now possible to connect your audio via the AC room, without using your telephone. You need a stable internet connection. If you would like a reminder of how to connect please let staff know.

Dear All,

The next EURALO Monthly Call is scheduled for *Tuesday, 26 July 2016 at 18:00 UTC* (20:00 CEST).

The agenda (to be updated) and call details are available at:

https://community.icann.org/x/hwObAw

Adobe Connect room:

http://icann.adobeconnect.com/euralo

Conference ID:

English: 1638

Dial-in numbers: http://adigo.com/icann/

EURALO Work space:

https://community.icann.org/x/K5Qi

If you require a dial-out please contact At-Large staff at:

staff@atlarge.icann.org

Thank you.

Regards,

Heidi Ullrich, Silvia Vivanco, Ariel Liang, Gisella Gruber, Nathalie Peregrine, Terri Agnew and Yeşim Nazlar

ICANN Policy Staff in support of the At-Large Community

E-mail: staff@atlarge.icann.org <mailto:staff@atlarge.icann.org>

Website: atlarge.icann.org <https://atlarge.icann.org/>

Facebook: facebook.com/icann <https://www.facebook.com/icannatlarge>atlarge <https://www.facebook.com/icannatlarge>

Twitter: @ <https://twitter.com/ICANNAtLarge>ICANNAtLarge <https://twitter.com/ICANNAtLarge>

unknown.png

-- Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD http://www.gih.com/ocl.html

_______________________________________________ euralo-tf-als-engagement mailing list euralo-tf-als-engagement@atlarge-lists.icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/euralo-tf-als-engagement

-- Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD http://www.gih.com/ocl.html

Dear Yrjö, thank you very much for starting this discussion. Please be so kind to find a few of my personal points of views, interspersed in your text: On 29/07/2016 16:32, Yrjö Länsipuro wrote:

Dear members of the Task Force,

A few thoughts on our task:

1) It is self-evident that without active ALS's, EURALO (like other RALOs and At Large itself) would be just an empty shell. The credibility of ALAC/At Large as "the primary organizational home within ICANN for individual Internet users" hinges on whether our voice is emanating from the grassroots or just from a club of "usual suspects".

Ever since I have been involved in At-Large this has been a key component part and potential criticism. Indeed, ICANN as a whole is often accused of being a small club of "usual suspects" and the mission for the ALAC & At-Large Community is to make sure it is not. It is a very serious mission indeed.

2) As we heard from Wolf at the EURALO call (July 26), earlier attempts at enhancing the grassroots engagement have been resisted by some ALS's as bureaucratic meddling from EURALO's side. As unjustified as such criticism may be, now we have to make absolutely sure that our efforts will not be seen in such light, and don't meet the same fate.

Today we are at an intersection with two more components which make the game very different indeed: 1. The implementation of the At-Large Summit recommendations These were decided by the At-Large community, drafted at the Summit in London (June 2014) and ratified unanimously by the ALAC. It is the will of the At-Large Community to proceed forward with these changes. The tracking of the recommendation implementation is on: https://community.icann.org/x/IJZCAw Recommendation #28 Recommendation #29 Recommendation #42 Recommendation #43 2. The current ALAC Review. This is a bylaw-mandated independent review of the ALAC and its component parts. Recommendations from the independent review are binding once the ALAC ratifies them and the plan is sent to the ICANN Board. The At-Large Review Working Party's page is on: https://community.icann.org/x/aZMQAw This second process will make recommendations on improving the RALOs which are non negotiable. I would think that ALSes which have a problem with the recommendations would be better served in taking part in the current process of self-improvement, rather than waiting to be told what to do in the RALO top down. Because I also have to add one more thing: the concept that a RALO is "sovereign" is completely false. The RALO has obligations to ICANN and if these obligations are not met, including working with ICANN on regional outreach and strategic plans, the ALAC has the option of ending its MoU with the RALO and to create a new one with new members.

3) If one looks at the EURALO ALS list (https://atlarge.icann.org/alses/euralo), two facts jump out. First, the *great diversity* of the ALS's as to their nature and areas of interest. Some cover a broad spectrum of internet and information society issues. Some are interested in a more narrow segment among them. Some are NGO's engaged in other fields that have joined the At Large because of the importance of the internet in their core activities. Thus, their engagement in At Large varies greatly in relevance and subject matter interest from one ALS to the next. Thus, *one size does not fit all*. ( The other salient feature is EURALO's lopsided geography, especially the absence of ALS's in some parts of Europe. That is a separate problem, but our work may also contribute to solving it)

Absolutely agreed -- but you know, EURALO is not the only region like this. The whole At-Large Community is very diverse. Hence ATLAS II recommendations #28 and #29.

4) Enhancing the measurable activity level of ALS's is not an end in itself. Statistics aside, we are first of all interested in their *activities that support the main role of At Large/ALAC* "to consider and provide advice on the activities of ICANN, insofar as they relate to the interests of individual Internet users". Thus, all potential expertise "hidden" in the ALS's should be discovered and leveraged in preparing ALAC advice on ICANN activities. This would relieve the workload of those few who now do most of the drafting. Here, the diversity and different fields of specialization of ALS's could actually be a great asset.

Ooops, sorry, at the risk of repeating myself -- see #28 & #29 :-) We are entirely in agreement.

5) An ALS can play an important role as *a component of the multistakeholder setup at the national level* and even as the initiator for national-level multistakeholder cooperation. To what extent this actually happens, varies from country to country, with have different traditions of communications among different sectors of the society, but the potential for improvement seems to be there. Like charity, multistakeholderism starts at home. The engagement of ALS´s in national multistakeholder cooperation should be actively promoted by EURALO, ie. by facilitating their contacts with other national level stakeholders active in ICANN. (The table prepared by Oksana is a good beginning for mapping the situation in various countries)

Absolutely agree.

*6) In my view, the Task Force should focus on (1) how to encourage the participation of fresh expert resources from the ALS's, according to their area of specialization, in the development of ALAC advice to ICANN's policy development processes and (2) how to encourage ALS's to play an active part in the multistakeholder processes on the national level.*

I would hope that the task force can also play a good part in the mapping & the topics of interest from #28 & #29. Last but not least, I think the task force should also be looking at the work of the At-Large ALS Criteria and Expectations Task Force. https://community.icann.org/x/AohCAw Kindest regards, Olivier -- Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD http://www.gih.com/ocl.html