Forwarding the email below to the list as requested. (No endorsement implied.) Greg ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: *Reg Levy* <reg@mindsandmachines.com> Date: Tuesday, April 12, 2016 Subject: [gnso-rpm-wg] Suggestion for Leadership Team To: Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc@gmail.com> Greg—I can't reply to the group from my phone, can you please forward this? All— I'd like to underscore the fact that Kathy represents users. Volker's suggestion of three co-chairs—representing IP rights holders, domain name rights holders, and end-users rights—strikes what I see as an appropriate balance. I'm often concerned that the only "rights" discussed when discussing "rights protection mechanisms" are IP rights (this is a registry perspective based on TMCH, Sunrise, URS, &., and I joined this group in the hopes of being convinced that this is not the state of affairs). Kathy's presence as a co-chair—even one of three—helps give me confidence that end users will have a voice in this conversation. P.S. I'd also like to third Kathy's nomination. Reg Levy (310) 963-7135 Sent from my iPhone. On Apr 12, 2016, at 09:30, Greg Shatan via gnso-rpm-wg < gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org');>> wrote: George, First, while domain names are almost certainly "intangible property," I don't see them considered as intellectual property, except to the extent they are an expression of a trademark or trade name, one letter from 1999 notwithstanding. But that's neither here nor there, and beyond the scope of the conversation. After all, trademark owners are also domain name owners (and, after domain investors, probably the most prolific domain name owners). Second, I don't think anything I've said has marginalized or delegitimized anyone, and I've gone to pains to say otherwise, if you look at my emails. Greg On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 12:00 PM, George Kirikos via gnso-rpm-wg < gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org');>> wrote:
Hello,
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 11:04 AM, Greg Shatan via gnso-rpm-wg < gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org');>> wrote:
On an informal or "de facto" level, J Scott tends to represent (or at least stand for) the interests of businesses for whom IP is a significant asset, while Phil represents (and actually does represent) the interests of domain investors (a very specific sector of the business community for whom IP is, at best, not a significant asset). As such, Phil's perspectives are far more aligned with those represented by Kathy, and that is the imbalance to which I refer.
Domain names have been recognized, in law, as a new form of intellectual property since the 1990's, e.g. see:
Umbro International, Inc., Judgment Creditor v. 3263851 Canada, Inc Judgment Debtor, and Network Solutions, Inc, Garnishee, At Law No. 174388.
https://web.archive.org/web/19991009052951/http://www.alston.com/docs/Articl...
"Until Umbro's effort, domain names apparently have not been subjected to garnishment, but that is no reason to conclude that this ****new form of intellectual property**** is therefore immune." (emphasis added)
I think instead of "IP" you meant "trademarks", a different form of intellectual property (which sometimes might overlap with, interact with, and/or conflict with domain names).
Certainly for my own company's domain names, and for many other owners of domain names, it would not be correct to say that these are "not a significant asset." Many domain names are worth thousands, hundreds of thousands, or even millions of dollars, and are significant assets to their owners.
I think participants in the working group should be more cautious before trying to marginalize or delegitimize others who are volunteering their valuable time and expertise to improve ICANN policymaking.
Sincerely,
George Kirikos 416-588-0269 http://www.leap.com/
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