Thank you Garth. I am preparing a set of amendments to our Operating procedures which will be read shortly. Alan At 31/07/2013 08:55 PM, Garth Bruen wrote:
Folks,
I've stayed out of this thread as long as possible to ensure a good discussion. However, here are my thoughts.
First, on sharing the post. I do not believe the community can or should make the two candidates share the post. I think it is up to the two candidates to reach an agreement on their own for doing that. Since there are no documented guidelines for who would do what in a shared post I would rather not throw two people into untested waters. In general, I am not opposed to the concept, but it needs to be clearly structured.
Second, on the tie breaker. I feel like letting the Chair pick is like giving one person two votes, not in favor of it. I don't like flipping a coin because the loser and their supporters will always feel cheated. Letting the ALAC chair decide may sound like a good idea, the ALAC Chair may not always know enough about a particular region's needs to choose wisely. So, that leaves the NARALO ALAC members with a tie-breaking vote. I believe this last option is the wisest and most democratic.
-Garth
-----Original Message----- From: na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [mailto:na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] On Behalf Of Glenn McKnight Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 6:43 PM Cc: NARALO Discussion List Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] Building consensus on dealing with the election tie
Hi Upon careful consideration of the plus and minuses of a shared position for secretariat, on paper it appears a good compromise but in reality it tends not to work well. I choice not to share the position for numerous reasons. I am sure NARALO will survive with either winner of a relection. . As stated I rather see the results of a reelection for the position
Glenn.
Glenn McKnight mcknight.glenn@gmail.com skype gmcknight twitter gmcknight .
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 5:12 PM, Gordon Chillcott <gordontc@look.ca> wrote:
After some thought, I' for another vote as well.
Gordon
On Wed, 2013-07-31 at 15:43 -0400, Thomas Lowenhaupt wrote:
+1
On 7/31/2013 3:19 PM, Joly MacFie wrote:
I'm with Eduardo. Another vote.
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 9:44 AM, Eduardo Diaz <eduardodiazrivera@gmail.com>wrote:
I will go for another vote. If there is another draw, then the three ALAC members from the region will move into action. However, since this not in any rules we should reach consensus on this (on any other solution) before executing. I do not believe sharing is a good option.
-ed
On Sat, Jul 27, 2013 at 10:06 PM, Thompson, Darlene < DThompson1@gov.nu.ca
wrote: Ah, good question Alan,
As we have been discussing for a while, there are quite a few areas in our Rules of Procedure that need to be updated. So, I am thinking that if we put a lot of time into a robust set of rules for this one matter, then we will have to address all of the other matters later. This will prolong the discussions on the list interminably on procedural matters. This would be a real distraction from the actual policy work that the NARALO should be focusing on. For that reason, I would be more in favour of dealing with changes to the RoP all at once. So, I am leaning towards getting this election over with and then a small subset can concentrate on re-drafting the RoP for the NARALO's consideration while the rest of the group can continue with important policy work.
I am also seeing now that the problem with option #3 - sharing of work - could be problematic if one of the candidates has no desire to do so. The RALO cannot really force this. The Rules of Procedure already ALLOW for it, so perhaps we need to have an either/or going forward. IF the tied parties agree to work together, allow it. If not, then option #1 (random selection) or #2 (vote by NARALO ALAC members) should be undertaken. This would have to be something that the group would need to decide on prior to re-holding the election although most seem to be leaning towards #2.
I have already indicated my preferences in the above, so this is something that the group needs to decide.
D
Darlene A. Thompson CAP Administrator N-CAP/Department of Education P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 Phone: (867) 975-5631 Fax: (867) 975-5610 dthompson@gov.nu.ca ________________________________________ From: Alan Greenberg [alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca] Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2013 3:50 PM To: Thompson, Darlene; Bob Bruen; Thomas Lowenhaupt Cc: NARALO Discussion List Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] Building consensus on dealing with the election tie
Thanks Darlene. There is no question that we need a obust set of rules that can handle situations such as this. The only immediate question, as I outlined in my earlier note, is do we need them for THIS election.
Alan
At 27/07/2013 03:18 PM, Thompson, Darlene wrote: > Thank you Bob, > > Along this line, when NARALO was still new and nobody really > knew what they were doing, Luc and I did just fine sharing > responsibilities. We e-mailed back and forth a lot and just > decided between us who would do what. It was pretty easy. > > NARALO has now grown a lot, as have the people within it. Each > person brings their own talents and skills to the table. I > think that Glenn and my talents are diverse enough that we > should be able to divvy up the workload and actually be able to > grow more initiatives for the region - each taking the lead in > what they prefer or where their skills are. I am quite > flexible and would, of course, do everything I can to make it > work - as I always do. I do not think that we need the job to > be "codified" as it is constantly changing as per the needs of the group. > > Having said that, I would also be in favour of the tie-breaker > solution offered by the 3 ALAC members but my preference will > always be to try to grow and expand the talent pool in the region. > > D > > Darlene A. Thompson > CAP Administrator > N-CAP/Department of Education > P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 > Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 > Phone: (867) 975-5631 > Fax: (867) 975-5610 > dthompson@gov.nu.ca > ________________________________________ > From: na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org > [na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] on behalf of Bob > Bruen [bruen@coldrain.net] > Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:24 PM > To: Thomas Lowenhaupt > Cc: NARALO Discussion List > Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] Building consensus on dealing with > the election tie > Hi, > > Darlene has been at this job for long enough to know what to > do. I expect > that she and Glenn could figure out how to share the responsibilities, > then let us know. They are both reasonable adults. If there is > a problem, > I am sure the Chair could be helpful in settling it. > > > --bob > > On Sat, 27 Jul 2013, Thomas Lowenhaupt wrote: > >> I think the shared responsibility can work. But we must define specific >> responsibilities and metrics for each co-secretary. These >> metrics will be >> quite helpful when the next election comes along, at least in > evaluating the >> performance of the cos. >> >> Tom Lowenhaupt >> >> >> >> On 7/27/2013 11:37 AM, Skuce, Allan wrote: >>> I still prefer #3. What an opportunity to grow, lead by >>> example, and deal >>> with the great workload. Cheers, Allan >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 4:13 PM, Dharma Dailey >>> <dharma.dailey@gmail.com>wrote: >>> >>>> Have we reached clarity on whether folks feel the job can be shared? The >>>> last message from Glenn, I recall, was along the lines of "looking into >>>> it." It might be easier on all parties if some of the >>>> details were >>>> discussed before hand so no one is surprised re: who is >>>> doing what. >>>> >>>> Dharma >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jul 26, 2013, at 6:44 PM, "Thompson, Darlene" < DThompson1@GOV.NU.CA> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> I would like to encourage all NARALO members to consider >>>>> the options >>>> that Evan has posited below and respond to same. Without consensus we >>>> cannot move forward on this issue. >>>>> Thank you for your time on this! >>>>> >>>>> D >>>>> >>>>> Darlene A. Thompson >>>>> CAP Administrator >>>>> N-CAP/Department of Education P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 >>>>> Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 >>>>> Phone: (867) 975-5631 >>>>> Fax: (867) 975-5610 >>>>> dthompson@gov.nu.ca >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org [ >>>> na-discuss-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org] on behalf of >>>> Evan > Leibovitch [ >>>> evan@telly.org] >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 4:44 PM >>>>> To: NARALO Discussion List >>>>> Subject: [NA-Discuss] Building consensus on dealing with >>>>> the > election tie >>>>> Hello all, >>>>> >>>>> I would like to suggest conducting a poll of NARALO members >>>>> on the best >>>> way >>>>> to deal with the tie for Secretariat resulting from the recently-held >>>> vote. >>>>> While we need to revise our regulations regarding >>>>> tie-breaking, we have >>>> an >>>>> immediate need to resolve the current situation before the >>>>> next ICANN >>>>> meeting. >>>>> >>>>> Based on discussions I have heard to date, there are three >>>>> paths to >>>>> resolving this that have received some interest: >>>>> >>>>> 1. Random tie-break >>>>> The votes for ALSs and unaffiliated members is re-held, >>>>> and the rules >>>>> are modified. If another tie results, the tie is broken >>>>> by a random >>>> method, >>>>> supervised by at least two non-candidate members and/or At-Large >>>>> staff. >>>>> >>>>> 2. Tie-break by NA-Region ALAC members >>>>> The votes for ALSs and unaffiliated members is re-held >>>>> and he rules >>>>> are >>>>> modified. If another tie results, the tie is broken by >>>>> a consensus >>>> achieved >>>>> in private by the three ALAC members for North America (Alan, Eduardo >>>> and >>>>> myself). Since there are three of us, no deadlock is >>>>> allowed there >>>>> 3. Shared Secretariat >>>>> No new election is held, and NARALO declares both >>>>> Darlene > and Glenn as >>>>> co-Secretariats. While there is no precedent for this >>>>> in > NARALO, there >>>> is >>>>> elsewhere in ICANN At-Large (both co-Chair and co-Secretariats have >>>> been >>>>> done in other regions). The two would alternate travel >>>>> to ICANN >>>> meetings >>>>> (though both would naturally be at the Summit in >>>>> London). In the case >>>> that >>>>> any of the North American At-Large leadership cannot >>>>> attend a meeting >>>>> (Chair, travel-designated secretariat or ALAC member), >>>>> the >>>> "non-travelling" >>>>> secretariat member would automatically be designated to >>>>> take that >>>> travel >>>>> allocation. The rules may still be modified in case of future ties, >>>>> but >>>>> such action is not required immediately. >>>>> >>>>> So I am proposing that, in advance of the next NARALO call, >>>>> we could do >>>> an >>>>> informal poll of members (by Bigpulse or Doodle) to gain a >>>>> sense of >>>>> preferences between these options that may help guide a >>>>> regional >>>> consensus >>>>> on the August call. >>>>> >>>>> Is this a workable plan? Are the options above a valid representation of >>>>> the ones discussed? (There are some other tie-break methods >>>>> I have >>>>> eliminated because of lack of support to date). >>>>> >>>>> I admit that when I started thinking about the tie I had >>>>> not given any >>>>> thought to the shared secretariat idea, but it has grown on >>>>> me since. >>>> There >>>>> is a significant amount of work to do, and it would be IMO >>>>> a shame to >>>> force >>>>> an all-or-nothing tiebreak on two people with both popular > support and an >>>>> eagerness to do the job. >>>>> >>>>> - Evan >>>>> ------ >>>>> NA-Discuss mailing list >>>>> NA-Discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org >>>>> >> ------ >> NA-Discuss mailing list >> NA-Discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org >> https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/na-discuss >> >> Visit the NARALO online at http://www.naralo.org >> ------ >> > -- > Dr. Robert Bruen > Cold Rain Labs > http://coldrain.net/bruen > +1.802.579.6288 > > ------ > NA-Discuss mailing list > NA-Discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org > https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/na-discuss > > Visit the NARALO online at http://www.naralo.org > ------ > ------ > NA-Discuss mailing list > NA-Discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org > https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/na-discuss > > Visit the NARALO online at http://www.naralo.org > ------ ------ NA-Discuss mailing list NA-Discuss@atlarge-lists.icann.org https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/na-discuss
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