In my mind, the real question is whether they are subject to any pressure from their own law enforcement and communications ministries. Alan At 13/04/2018 07:15 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:
Hate to say I told you so. But its proof of my own estimation that the response was going to be a yawn.
I cannot understand why given the history and an competent understanding of how any bureaucracy, much less a Eurocrat one, defined in law and bounded by practice, would suddenly change their collective minds!
-Carlton
============================== Carlton A Samuels Mobile: 876-818-1799 Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround =============================
On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 5:47 AM, Volker Greimann <<mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>vgreimann@key-systems.net> wrote: As this may be somewhat relevant to the work we are doing, here is a link to the response of the Art. 29 WG to ICANNs letter:
To be sure, there is nothing substantially new in here, it re-iterates positions that many have voiced towards ICANN for years now, but it does provide a clear overview of where ICANNs proposed interim model falls short, and what the constrants to tiered access would be. While some already interpret this as "whois is dead!", I would not go so far, but for certain uses - beneficial as they may be - that statement probably applies. In general, this seems to provide a solid basis for further work, but ICANN should not have wasted its time waiting for this response instead of continuing to refine their interim model with what everyone (but ICANN Org apparently) was already expecting.
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen GrüÃen,
Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>vgreimann@key-systems.net
Web: <http://www.key-systems.net>www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.domaindiscount24.com>www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP <http://www.keydrive.lu>www.keydrive.lu
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann - legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>vgreimann@key-systems.net
Web: <http://www.key-systems.net>www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.domaindiscount24.com>www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems
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True. But here's the pwrfect example of being between a rock and a hard place. If they cave they can kiss telling anybody, including Tuvalu, "you must do so and so to play" goodbye forever! First one on the list is 'the right to be forgotten'! Take it as gospel every mother's son would invoke the 'security consideration' exception hereafter. Just like China is insisting and being told no. -Carlton On Sat, 14 Apr 2018, 3:46 pm Alan Greenberg, <alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca> wrote:
In my mind, the real question is whether they are subject to any pressure from their own law enforcement and communications ministries. Alan
At 13/04/2018 07:15 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:
Hate to say I told you so. But its proof of my own estimation that the response was going to be a yawn.
I cannot understand why given the history and an competent understanding of how any bureaucracy, much less a Eurocrat one, defined in law and bounded by practice, would suddenly change their collective minds!
-Carlton
============================== *Carlton A Samuels*
*Mobile: 876-818-1799 *Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround =============================
On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 5:47 AM, Volker Greimann < vgreimann@key-systems.net> wrote: As this may be somewhat relevant to the work we are doing, here is a link to the response of the Art. 29 WG to ICANNs letter:
https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/correspondence/jelinek-to-marby-11apr1...
To be sure, there is nothing substantially new in here, it re-iterates positions that many have voiced towards ICANN for years now, but it does provide a clear overview of where ICANNs proposed interim model falls short, and what the constrants to tiered access would be. While some already interpret this as "whois is dead!", I would not go so far, but for certain uses - beneficial as they may be - that statement probably applies. In general, this seems to provide a solid basis for further work, but ICANN should not have wasted its time waiting for this response instead of continuing to refine their interim model with what everyone (but ICANN Org apparently) was already expecting.
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.rrpproxy.net/> www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.brandshelter.com/>
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann - legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.rrpproxy.net/> www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.brandshelter.com/>
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems
CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
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Are you joking? they spend half their lives dealing with those guys. And their own governments. It is not exactly a cushy job. Requires some spine. SP On 2018-04-14 15:32, Alan Greenberg wrote:
In my mind, the real question is whether they are subject to any pressure from their own law enforcement and communications ministries. Alan
At 13/04/2018 07:15 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:
Hate to say I told you so. But its proof of my own estimation that the response was going to be a yawn.
I cannot understand why given the history and an competent understanding of how any bureaucracy, much less a Eurocrat one, defined in law and bounded by practice, would suddenly change their collective minds!
-Carlton
============================== /Carlton A Samuels/ /Mobile: 876-818-1799 //Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround/ =============================
On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 5:47 AM, Volker Greimann <vgreimann@key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>> wrote:
As this may be somewhat relevant to the work we are doing, here is a link to the response of the Art. 29 WG to ICANNs letter:
https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/correspondence/jelinek-to-marby-11apr1...
To be sure, there is nothing substantially new in here, it re-iterates positions that many have voiced towards ICANN for years now, but it does provide a clear overview of where ICANNs proposed interim model falls short, and what the constrants to tiered access would be. While some already interpret this as "whois is dead!", I would not go so far, but for certain uses - beneficial as they may be - that statement probably applies. In general, this seems to provide a solid basis for further work, but ICANN should not have wasted its time waiting for this response instead of continuing to refine their interim model with what everyone (but ICANN Org apparently) was already expecting.
-- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>
Web: www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.rrpproxy.net/> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> / www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.brandshelter.com/>
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann - legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: vgreimann@key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>
Web: www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.rrpproxy.net/> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> / www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.brandshelter.com/>
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
_______________________________________________ RDS-WHOIS2-RT mailing list RDS-WHOIS2-RT@icann.org <mailto:RDS-WHOIS2-RT@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/rds-whois2-rt <https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/rds-whois2-rt>
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I didn't say they didn't talk and I didn't say it was an easy job. Alan At 14/04/2018 05:40 PM, Stephanie Perrin wrote:
Are you joking? they spend half their lives dealing with those guys. And their own governments. It is not exactly a cushy job. Requires some spine.
SP On 2018-04-14 15:32, Alan Greenberg wrote:
In my mind, the real question is whether they are subject to any pressure from their own law enforcement and communications ministries. Alan
At 13/04/2018 07:15 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:
Hate to say I told you so. But its proof of my own estimation that the response was going to be a yawn.
I cannot understand why given the history and an competent understanding of how any bureaucracy, much less a Eurocrat one, defined in law and bounded by practice, would suddenly change their collective minds!
-Carlton
============================== Carlton A Samuels Mobile: 876-818-1799 Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround =============================
On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 5:47 AM, Volker Greimann <<mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net> vgreimann@key-systems.net> wrote: As this may be somewhat relevant to the work we are doing, here is a link to the response of the Art. 29 WG to ICANNs letter:
To be sure, there is nothing substantially new in here, it re-iterates positions that many have voiced towards ICANN for years now, but it does provide a clear overview of where ICANNs proposed interim model falls short, and what the constrants to tiered access would be. While some already interpret this as "whois is dead!", I would not go so far, but for certain uses - beneficial as they may be - that statement probably applies. In general, this seems to provide a solid basis for further work, but ICANN should not have wasted its time waiting for this response instead of continuing to refine their interim model with what everyone (but ICANN Org apparently) was already expecting. -- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen GrüÃen,
Volker A. Greimann - Rechtsabteilung - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: <http://www.key-systems.net>www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.domaindiscount24.com>www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook: <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP <http://www.keydrive.lu>www.keydrive.lu
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen. -------------------------------------------- Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann - legal department - Key-Systems GmbH Im Oberen Werk 1 66386 St. Ingbert Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901 Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851 Email: <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>vgreimann@key-systems.net Web: <http://www.key-systems.net>www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.domaindiscount24.com>www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated: <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>www.facebook.com/KeySystems www.twitter.com/key_systems CEO: Alexander Siffrin Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534 Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP <http://www.keydrive.lu>www.keydrive.lu This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
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Fortunately many have the status of the judiciary and are not likely to be pushed. Some are less independent than others. But the key ones here are IMHO not so likely to cave in at this point. Of course, that is an outsider viewpoint, others within the EU may know better. And of course, that is a civil society view of the matter, not one necessarily shared by others on this review team. SP On 2018-04-14 17:50, Alan Greenberg wrote:
I didn't say they didn't talk and I didn't say it was an easy job.
Alan
At 14/04/2018 05:40 PM, Stephanie Perrin wrote:
Are you joking? they spend half their lives dealing with those guys. And their own governments. It is not exactly a cushy job. Requires some spine.
SP On 2018-04-14 15:32, Alan Greenberg wrote:
In my mind, the real question is whether they are subject to any pressure from their own law enforcement and communications ministries. Alan
At 13/04/2018 07:15 PM, Carlton Samuels wrote:
Hate to say I told you so. But its proof of my own estimation that the response was going to be a yawn.
I cannot understand why given the history and an competent understanding of how any bureaucracy, much less a Eurocrat one, defined in law and bounded by practice, would suddenly change their collective minds!
-Carlton
============================== /Carlton A Samuels/ /Mobile: 876-818-1799 //Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround/ =============================
On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 5:47 AM, Volker Greimann <vgreimann@key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net>> wrote:
As this may be somewhat relevant to the work we are doing, here is a link to the response of the Art. 29 WG to ICANNs letter:
https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/correspondence/jelinek-to-marby-11apr1...
To be sure, there is nothing substantially new in here, it re-iterates positions that many have voiced towards ICANN for years now, but it does provide a clear overview of where ICANNs proposed interim model falls short, and what the constrants to tiered access would be. While some already interpret this as "whois is dead!", I would not go so far, but for certain uses - beneficial as they may be - that statement probably applies. In general, this seems to provide a solid basis for further work, but ICANN should not have wasted its time waiting for this response instead of continuing to refine their interim model with what everyone (but ICANN Org apparently) was already expecting. -- Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
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participants (3)
-
Alan Greenberg -
Carlton Samuels -
Stephanie Perrin