Oct. 30, 2015
3:33 a.m.
Yes Leon. Would be pleased to. On 10/30/15 2:26 PM, León Felipe Sánchez Ambía wrote: > Thanks for this offer Paul. Would you be able to provide this > explanation on our call? > > > Best regards, > > > León > >> El 28/10/2015, a las 3:39 p.m., Paul Twomey >> <paul.twomey@argopacific.com <mailto:paul.twomey@argopacific.com>> >> escribió: >> >> HI Niels >> >> Thanks for your reply. >> >> I think the best I can do is ask for some time on Friday to explain >> the practical steps involved in changes of tld operator (especially a >> cctld operator) both through requests for redelegation and also >> requests for changes in the zone file through the IANA process. >> Because it is several of these where I see ICANN being practically >> engaged in recognizing end empowering a related party which could be >> guilty of human rights abuse. >> >> As for the Ruggie Principles, let me point again to principle 13 and >> its commentary (and that of principle 19): >> >> 13. >> >> The responsibility to respect human rights requires that business >> >> enterprises: >> >> (a) >> >> Avoid causing or contributing to adverse human rights impacts >> >> through their own activities, and address such impacts when they >> >> occur; >> >> (b) >> >> Seek to prevent or mitigate adverse human rights impacts that are >> >> *directly linked to their operations, products or services by their * >> >> ** >> >> *business relationships*, even if they have not contributed to those >> >> impacts. >> >> (/Emphasis added - this is the nature of the IANA functions >> relationship with ccTLDs) // >> / >> >> >> Commentary >> >> Business enterprises may be involved with adverse human rights >> impacts either >> >> through their own activities or as a result of their business >> relationships with >> >> other parties. Guiding Principle 19 elaborates further on the >> implications for >> >> how business enterprises should address these situations. For the >> purpose of >> >> these Guiding Principles a business enterprise’s “activities” are >> understood >> >> to include both actions and omissions; and its “business >> relationships” are >> >> understood to include relationships with business partners, entities >> in its >> >> value chain, and any other non-State or State entity directly linked >> to its >> >> business operations, products or services >> >> Commentary on Principle 19 >> >> The more complex the situation and its implications for human rights, the >> >> stronger is the case for the enterprise to draw on independent expert >> advice >> >> in deciding how to respond. */(ICANN is the body to make decisions on >> tlds - there is not another expert body)/* >> >> If the business enterprise has leverage to prevent or mitigate the >> adverse >> >> impact, it should exercise it. And if it lacks leverage there may be >> ways for >> >> the enterprise to increase it. Leverage may be increased by, for example, >> >> offering capacity-building or other incentives to the related entity, or >> >> collaborating with other actors. */(ICANN should not be asked to put >> political leverage on a government - it will destroy its apolitical >> role)/**//* >> >> *//* >> >> There are situations in which the enterprise lacks the leverage to >> prevent >> >> or mitigate adverse impacts and is unable to increase its leverage. Here, >> >> the enterprise should consider ending the relationship, taking into >> account >> >> credible assessments of potential adverse human rights impacts of >> doing so. *(ICANN cannot consider ending a relationship with a cctld >> and still operate the IANA functions )*** >> >> ** * >> ** >> *It seems to me that Ruggie Principles basically are saying if >> another party in which you are in a business relationship continues >> to breach human rights you should consider ending the relationship. >> >> this is just what ICANN can NOT do with a ccTLD or even some TLD >> operators if it is going to continue to be the protocol coordinator >> of a single Interoperable Internet. >> >> But if it does not breach these relationships one can just see the >> level of litigation from human rights and dissident groups which >> could be brought against ICANN if it does adopt these principles >> without amendment. >> >> Paul >> >> >> >> On 10/27/15 3:34 AM, Niels ten Oever wrote: >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>> Hash: SHA256 >>> >>> Hi Paul, >>> >>> I'm sorry for responding this late. Please find my response inline: >>> >>> On 10/20/2015 04:09 AM, Paul Twomey wrote: >>>> Niels >>>> >>>> I am again confronted with the challenge of understanding exactly >>>> what these broadly stated proposals mean. >>>> >>> We did our best to be precise, but maybe we haven't sufficiently >>> succeeded. Could you please point our which proposals or >>> recommendation (in the report) you mean with 'these broadly stated >>> proposals'? >>> >>>> Does your paper just refer to the process within ICANN of creating >>>> policy - or does it apply to the application of that policy? >>>> >>> As the paper described, a human rights review could be part of the >>> Policy Develop Process. But to have a full human rights report, the >>> impact of ICANN's policies and operations should be assessed. >>> >>>> For instance, concerning specific ICANN necessary functions would >>>> you be able to tell me how the process recommended in this paper >>>> would apply to the GAC principles on redelgation of ccTLDs or the >>>> ccNSO process which has been underway on redelgations? These are >>>> both products of policy making processes. >>>> >>> The report recommends a way forward, based on international best >>> practices, for creating a human rights policy, the content of the >>> policy and how it would be implemented is of course up for discussion >>> in an appropriate process. >>> >>>> Does it mean that freedom of expression has to be an overriding >>>> principle in these cases - and if so how do you see >>>> operationalizing that? >>> I don't think this was mentioned or implied anywhere in the report. >>> Rights need to be balanced, the challenge is to come up with a >>> framework to do this in the best way. >>> >>>> If a government, operating clearly under its laws, requests the >>>> redelegation of ccTLD from one body to another because the new law >>>> empowers the government to get information about domain name >>>> registrants from the new body and to order the new body to remove >>>> registrations on instructions from the government (I know of at >>>> least 2 examples just like this happening in the last 10 years) and >>>> if such a request is consistent with the GAC principles etc, it >>>> seems to me that your paper implies that ICANN would be required to >>>> either deny this request or require that the existing policy >>>> processes be changed. >>>> >>>> Have I got it right? Or is it just that in the policy development >>>> process all who wanted to participate had the freedom to express >>>> their views? >>>> >>> The latter is the case. >>> >>>> Please understand that I also think that we should try to hold >>>> ICANN to human rights standards but I remain concerned that as soon >>>> as the Ruggles Principles emerge as the answer I keep finding >>>> related party issues which could really destabilize the whole ICANN >>>> mission. >>>> >>> Am very happy to discuss this with you, you mentioned this before, but >>> I am still a bit unclear which part of the Ruggie principles could >>> potentially destabilize ICANN. >>> >>>> The bottom line is that ICANN has to support EVERY ccTLD and TLD >>>> operator if we are going to have a single interoperable Internet. >>>> It is not like a business - a business can agree not to do business >>>> in a particular country. ICANN will not be able to do so and >>>> fulfill its mission. >>> I think it is crucial for an organization to know and show where there >>> are (risk for) human rights abuses in relation to their operations and >>> think about ways how these can be re-mediated or improved upon, this >>> by no way automatically means that ICANN cannot do x or y or engage >>> with a specific country or business. >>> >>> There are also other bodies that have done this, such as the >>> International Bar Association. >>> >>>> I look forward to your response. >>>> >>> Again, sorry for the late reply, am looking forward to your thoughts. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Niels >>> >>> >>>> Best >>>> >>>> Paul >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 10/19/15 9:26 PM, Niels ten Oever wrote: Dear Paul, >>>> >>>> This was indeed meant to inform WP4 on the activity in the CCWP-HR >>>> and give an example of what the considerations and work in WS2 >>>> might look like. >>>> >>>> Looking forward to hear your comments and/or questions. >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Niels >>>> >>>> On 10/19/2015 09:10 AM, Avri Doria wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I think it is informational. Explains many of the things we >>>>>>> have been discussing. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It is the output of a parallel work effort and is meant to >>>>>>> inform. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> avri >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 19-Oct-15 00:58, Paul Twomey wrote: >>>>>>>> Sorry Niels >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I am not attending Dublin. Can you please inform me how >>>>>>>> this document fits within the work of Working Party 4? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Paul >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 10/18/15 2:19 AM, Niels ten Oever wrote: >>>>>>>>> Dear WP4 members, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It's with great pleasure that I send you the the report >>>>>>>>> prepared by the CCWP-HR on ICANNâs Corporate >>>>>>>>> Responsibility to respect Human Rights: Recommendations >>>>>>>>> for developing Human Rights Review Process and >>>>>>>>> Reporting. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The report will be presented and discussed during our >>>>>>>>> session on Wednesday October 21 at 9:00 in Wicklow MR5 or >>>>>>>>> via remote participation [0] for which you all have been >>>>>>>>> invited. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I trust this report will help further the discussion on >>>>>>>>> how ICANN can live up to its responsibility to respect >>>>>>>>> human rights. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Looking forward to discuss. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Niels >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> PS Feel free to spread the report widely. it can also be >>>>>>>>> found on the website of the CCWP-HR: >>>>>>>>> https://tinyurl.com/cchumanrights >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> [0] >>>>>>>>> https://meetings.icann.org/en/dublin54/schedule/wed-ccwp-human-ri >>> ght >>> s-morning >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Wp4 mailing list Wp4@icann.org <mailto:Wp4@icann.org> >>>>>>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/wp4 >>>>>>>> -- Dr Paul Twomey Managing Director Argo P@cific >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> US Cell: +1 310 279 2366 Aust M: +61 416 238 501 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> www.argopacific.com <http://www.argopacific.com> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Wp4 mailing >>>>>>>> list Wp4@icann.org >>>>>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/wp4 >>>>>>> --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast >>>>>>> antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ Wp4 mailing >>>>>>> list Wp4@icann.org <mailto:Wp4@icann.org> >>>>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/wp4 >>>>>>> >>>> -- Niels ten Oever Head of Digital >>>> >>>> Article 19 www.article19.org <http://www.article19.org> >>>> >>>> PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D >>>> 68E9 >>>>> _______________________________________________ Wp4 mailing list >>>>> Wp4@icann.org <mailto:Wp4@icann.org> >>>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/wp4 >>> - -- Niels ten Oever >>> Head of Digital >>> >>> Article 19 >>> www.article19.org <http://www.article19.org> >>> >>> PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 >>> 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >>> Version: GnuPG v2 >>> >>> iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWLlYIAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjpyqMH/jpSWGVUXhGgNaEbIqn2qW8q >>> 3FhfkV6kPj/ovZXsZRcwIJHVJ25EmIcy4ROMggtGmfSQBYIs+jiJggbt+ZQgvTOb >>> BkiYBEDIhU5ohBX/UTaJ5rIN04FHk70+q2T2DkYLlDIA32UewiSsK79l99Ejo9zr >>> oPy+Cjin225ifcUh6Tdx78zkNa7p7DX/YVC/dMFww1yfsa7gJwuStufyIZVLz7Wr >>> 9JPpNWs6WB5EIU/6n3wExeeoqWllrOcANsw8efTdFfzxBuoMHr0u7P6VptHrRGhT >>> kXVsA9JL9ir/W4XS/lg1F0VmfW1ff2RIzGLlGRd/7jWq0P92d0eRXbK7SadcE9M= >>> =207Z >>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wp4 mailing list >>> Wp4@icann.org <mailto:Wp4@icann.org> >>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/wp4 >> >> -- >> Dr Paul Twomey >> Managing Director >> Argo P@cific >> >> US Cell: +1 310 279 2366 >> Aust M: +61 416 238 501 >> >> www.argopacific.com <http://www.argopacific.com/> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wp4 mailing list >> Wp4@icann.org <mailto:Wp4@icann.org> >> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/wp4 > -- Dr Paul Twomey Managing Director Argo P@cific US Cell: +1 310 279 2366 Aust M: +61 416 238 501 www.argopacific.com