Re: [cc-humanrights] cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23
I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights. On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova)
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Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000 From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: "cc-humanrights@icann.org" <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Implementation cannot be in a vacuum Unfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked..
Mr. Michele Neylon Blacknight http://www.blacknight.irish Sent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers!
On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece. SP
On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri
Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :)
What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ?
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 12:57, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
good point. perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support human rights?
avri
On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial to have someone who wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?human rights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone from that side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele
-- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation & Domains > http://www.blacknight.host/ > http://blog.blacknight.com/ > http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty > Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > > On 29/09/2015 00:16, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Niels ten Oever" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of niels@article19.org> wrote: > Hello everyone,
Please find underneath my proposal for the draft agenda. Looking forward to hear your ideas and criticisms. I was thinking of asking more people to comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quite high. Looking forward to hear what you think.
Best,
Niels
PS I did not confirm anyone yet.
Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session ===================================
Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes
Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law (GAC WG co-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes
Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - 5 minutes
Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes
Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact assessments and CSR reporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes
Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4)
Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC)
Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC)
Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO)
Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC)
Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board)
Q&A
Summary (Marilia)
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Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400 From: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> To: <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19 www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi,
Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw.
We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go.
And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR.
So I differentiate between
"I support hr, but ..."
and
"I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this"
avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300 From: Alexandra Kulikova <alex.kulikova@gmail.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi all
There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical. They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had re blocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions.
A. On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin" <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19 www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi,
Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw.
We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go.
And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR.
So I differentiate between
"I support hr, but ..."
and
"I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this"
avri
_______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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_______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
Susan Good evening; as “staff” can I just confirm that many of us have been fighting HR issues for many years; we are all ultimately accountable; whatever our roles; Best Nigel From: Niels ten Oever <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org>> on behalf of susan aaronson <saaronson2@verizon.net<mailto:saaronson2@verizon.net>> Date: Tuesday 29 September 2015 21:22 To: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23 I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights. On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights-request@icann.org> wrote: Send cc-humanrights mailing list submissions to cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to cc-humanrights-request@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights-request@icann.org> You can reach the person managing the list at cc-humanrights-owner@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights-owner@icann.org> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of cc-humanrights digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000 From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com><mailto:michele@blacknight.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca><mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: "cc-humanrights@icann.org"<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org><mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com><mailto:6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Implementation cannot be in a vacuum Unfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked.. Mr. Michele Neylon Blacknight http://www.blacknight.irish Sent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers! On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca><mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote: concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece. SP On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :) What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ? Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 12:57, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria"<mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org><mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> wrote: good point. perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support human rights? avri On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial to have someone who wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?human rights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone from that side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele -- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation & Domains > http://www.blacknight.host/ > http://blog.blacknight.com/ > http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty > Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > > On 29/09/2015 00:16, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Niels ten Oever"<mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofNielstenOever> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of niels@article19.org><mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofniels@article19.org> wrote: > Hello everyone, Please find underneath my proposal for the draft agenda. Looking forward to hear your ideas and criticisms. I was thinking of asking more people to comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quite high. Looking forward to hear what you think. Best, Niels PS I did not confirm anyone yet. Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session =================================== Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law (GAC WG co-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - 5 minutes Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact assessments and CSR reporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4) Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC) Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC) Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO) Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC) Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board) Q&A Summary (Marilia) _______________________________________________ >> cc-humanrights mailing list >> cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> >> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights > _______________________________________________ > cc-humanrights mailing list > cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> > https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400 From: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca><mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> To: <cc-humanrights@icann.org><mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca><mailto:560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions? Best, Niels Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org<http://www.article19.org> PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal. But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space.. So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria"<mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org><mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> wrote: Hi, Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw. We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go. And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR. So I differentiate between "I support hr, but ..." and "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this" avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAK qJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsi QZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P 8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeB vtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7u oA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs= =0wvf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300 From: Alexandra Kulikova <alex.kulikova@gmail.com><mailto:alex.kulikova@gmail.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca><mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org><mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com><mailto:CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Hi all There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical. They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had re blocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions. A. On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin" <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca><mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote: Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions? Best, Niels Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org<http://www.article19.org> PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal. But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space.. So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria"<mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org><mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> wrote: Hi, Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw. We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go. And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR. So I differentiate between "I support hr, but ..." and "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this" avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAK qJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsi QZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P 8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeB vtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7u oA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs= =0wvf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org<mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
It would be useful to have a board member as I have heard strongly held views from some on the board-against this concept, although they may have mellowed since the CWG Chris LaHatte Ombudsman Blog https://omblog.icann.org/ Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman Confidentiality All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint From: cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org [mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Nigel Hickson Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2015 8:52 AM To: susan aaronson <saaronson2@verizon.net>; Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23 Susan Good evening; as "staff" can I just confirm that many of us have been fighting HR issues for many years; we are all ultimately accountable; whatever our roles; Best Nigel From: Niels ten Oever <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org> > on behalf of susan aaronson <saaronson2@verizon.net <mailto:saaronson2@verizon.net> > Date: Tuesday 29 September 2015 21:22 To: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org>
Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23 I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights. On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-request@icann.org> wrote: Send cc-humanrights mailing list submissions to cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to cc-humanrights-request@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-request@icann.org> You can reach the person managing the list at cc-humanrights-owner@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-owner@icann.org> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of cc-humanrights digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000 From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <mailto:michele@blacknight.com> <michele@blacknight.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> "cc-humanrights@icann.org" <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <mailto:6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Implementation cannot be in a vacuum Unfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked.. Mr. Michele Neylon Blacknight http://www.blacknight.irish Sent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers! On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin <mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote: concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece. SP On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :) What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ? Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 12:57, <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote: good point. perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support human rights? avri On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial to have someone who wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?human rights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone from that side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele -- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation & Domains > http://www.blacknight.host/ > http://blog.blacknight.com/ > http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty > Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > > On 29/09/2015 00:16, <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofNielstenOever> "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Niels ten Oever <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofNielstenOever> " <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofniels@article19.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of niels@article19.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofniels@article19.org> > wrote: > Hello everyone, Please find underneath my proposal for the draft agenda. Looking forward to hear your ideas and criticisms. I was thinking of asking more people to comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quite high. Looking forward to hear what you think. Best, Niels PS I did not confirm anyone yet. Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session =================================== Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law (GAC WG co-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - 5 minutes Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact assessments and CSR reporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4) Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC) Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC) Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO) Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC) Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board) Q&A Summary (Marilia) _______________________________________________ >> cc-humanrights mailing list >> cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> >> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights > _______________________________________________ > cc-humanrights mailing list > cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> > https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400 From: Stephanie Perrin <mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> To: <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <mailto:560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions? Best, Niels Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org <http://www.article19.org> PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal. But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space.. So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 13:35, <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> " <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org>
wrote:
Hi, Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw. We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go. And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR. So I differentiate between "I support hr, but ..." and "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this" avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAK qJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsi QZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P 8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeB vtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7u oA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs= =0wvf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300 From: Alexandra Kulikova <mailto:alex.kulikova@gmail.com> <alex.kulikova@gmail.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: Human Rights <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <mailto:CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Hi all There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical. They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had re blocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions. A. On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin" <mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote: Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions? Best, Niels Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org <http://www.article19.org> PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal. But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space.. So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 13:35, <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> " <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org <mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org>
wrote:
Hi, Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw. We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go. And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR. So I differentiate between "I support hr, but ..." and "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this" avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAK qJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsi QZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P 8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeB vtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7u oA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs= =0wvf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org <mailto:cc-humanrights@icann.org> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
Most important think is the development of sens of responsibility. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------With kind regards;Coppens Pasteur NDAYIRAGIJEIT Specialist; System and Network Administrator-Manager of the Government Communication System (COMGOV) & National Datacenter at SETIC Burundi; Chairman of BurundiX A.S.B.L/ Burundian IXP Non-profit Association; and ISOC Burundi Chapter Member. Mobile: +257 (79/76) 365 000Email: coppens.ndayiragije@yahoo.comREPUBLIC OF BURUNDI-AFRICA On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 12:18 PM, Chris LaHatte <chris.lahatte@icann.org> wrote: #yiv6958545329 #yiv6958545329 -- _filtered #yiv6958545329 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv6958545329 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv6958545329 {font-family:Garamond;panose-1:2 2 4 4 3 3 1 1 8 3;} _filtered #yiv6958545329 {font-family:Consolas;panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv6958545329 {panose-1:2 4 6 4 5 5 5 2 3 4;}#yiv6958545329 #yiv6958545329 p.yiv6958545329MsoNormal, #yiv6958545329 li.yiv6958545329MsoNormal, #yiv6958545329 div.yiv6958545329MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv6958545329 a:link, #yiv6958545329 span.yiv6958545329MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv6958545329 a:visited, #yiv6958545329 span.yiv6958545329MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv6958545329 pre {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:10.0pt;}#yiv6958545329 span.yiv6958545329HTMLPreformattedChar {}#yiv6958545329 span.yiv6958545329EmailStyle19 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv6958545329 .yiv6958545329MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered #yiv6958545329 {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv6958545329 div.yiv6958545329WordSection1 {}#yiv6958545329 It would be useful to have a board member as I have heard strongly held views from some on the board-against this concept, although they may have mellowed since the CWG Chris LaHatteOmbudsmanBlog https://omblog.icann.org/Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman ConfidentialityAll matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint From: cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org [mailto:cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Nigel Hickson Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2015 8:52 AM To: susan aaronson <saaronson2@verizon.net>; Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23 Susan Good evening; as “staff” can I just confirm that many of us have been fighting HR issues for many years; we are all ultimately accountable; whatever our roles; Best Nigel From: Niels ten Oever <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of susan aaronson <saaronson2@verizon.net> Date: Tuesday 29 September 2015 21:22 To: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23 I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights. On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org wrote: Send cc-humanrights mailing list submissions to cc-humanrights@icann.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrightsor, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to cc-humanrights-request@icann.org You can reach the person managing the list at cc-humanrights-owner@icann.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specificthan "Re: Contents of cc-humanrights digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com>To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca>Cc: "cc-humanrights@icann.org" <cc-humanrights@icann.org>Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public sessionMessage-ID: <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Implementation cannot be in a vacuumUnfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked.. Mr. Michele NeylonBlacknighthttp://www.blacknight.irishSent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers! On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote: concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece.SP On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:Avri Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :) What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ? Regards Michele --Mr Michele NeylonBlacknight SolutionsHosting, Colocation & Domainshttp://www.blacknight.host/http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/Int.... +353 (0) 59 9183072Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090-------------------------------Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,SleatyRoad,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 12:57, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote: good point.perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support humanrights? avri On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial to have someone who wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?humanrights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone fromthat side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele -- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation & Domains > http://www.blacknight.host/ > http://blog.blacknight.com/ >http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353(0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight InternetSolutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty >Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > >On 29/09/2015 00:16, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf ofNiels ten Oever" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf ofniels@article19.org> wrote: > Hello everyone, Please find underneath my proposal for the draft agenda. Lookingforward to hear your ideas and criticisms. I was thinking of askingmore people to comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quitehigh. Looking forward to hear what you think. Best, Niels PS I did not confirm anyone yet. Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session=================================== Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law (GAC WGco-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - 5 minutes Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact assessments and CSRreporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4) Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC) Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC) Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO) Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC) Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board) Q&A Summary (Marilia) _______________________________________________ >> cc-humanrights mailing list >> cc-humanrights@icann.org >> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights >_______________________________________________ > cc-humanrights mailinglist > cc-humanrights@icann.org >https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ---This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ------------------------------ Message: 2Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400From: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca>To: <cc-humanrights@icann.org>Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public sessionMessage-ID: <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest.SPOn 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----Hash: SHA256 Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to addothers. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interestedin asking critical questions? Best, Niels Niels ten OeverHead of Digital Article 19www.article19.org PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing abunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially,illegal. But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made.Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted outlater has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within theICANN space.. So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarityon a variety of things before pushing hard for it. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation &Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353(0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight InternetSolutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,SleatyRoad,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf ofAvri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf ofavri@acm.org> wrote: Hi, Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did notsupport a HR bylaw. We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, buti think there is a divison between those who belive in thecommittment first and working it out as we go. And those who want to know exactly what the future holds beforemaking a committment to HR. So I differentiate between "I support hr, but ..." and "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going toimplement this" avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrightsmailing list cc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAKqJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsiQZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeBvtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7uoA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs==0wvf-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----_______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights ------------------------------ Message: 3Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300From: Alexandra Kulikova <alex.kulikova@gmail.com>To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca>Cc: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org>Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public sessionMessage-ID: <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Hi all There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical.They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had reblocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions. A.On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin" <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca>wrote: Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, Iwould suggest.SPOn 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----Hash: SHA256 Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to addothers. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interestedin asking critical questions? Best, Niels Niels ten OeverHead of Digital Article 19www.article19.org PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing abunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially,illegal. But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made.Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted outlater has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within theICANN space.. So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarityon a variety of things before pushing hard for it. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation &Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353(0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight InternetSolutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,SleatyRoad,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf ofAvri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf ofavri@acm.org> wrote: Hi, Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did notsupport a HR bylaw. We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, buti think there is a divison between those who belive in thecommittment first and working it out as we go. And those who want to know exactly what the future holds beforemaking a committment to HR. So I differentiate between "I support hr, but ..." and "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going toimplement this" avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrightsmailing list cc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAKqJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsiQZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeBvtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7uoA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs==0wvf-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----_______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights _______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights -------------- next part --------------An HTML attachment was scrubbed...URL: <http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/cc-humanrights/attachments/20150929/7ee2991c/a...> ------------------------------ _______________________________________________cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights End of cc-humanrights Digest, Vol 10, Issue 23********************************************** -- Susan Ariel Aaronson, Ph.D.Research Professor of International Affairs, Institute of International Economic PolicyElliott School of International Affairs, George Washington Universityhttp://www.gwu.edu/~elliott/faculty/aaronson.cfm Please visit the Trade and the Internet Project Web site:http://www.gwu.edu/~iiep/signatureinitiatives/governance/taig/The Trade, Trust, Transparency and Accountability page is: http://www.gwu.edu/~iiep/signatureinitiatives/governance/Trade_Trust_Transpa... For the Repression, Civil conflict, and Leadership Tenure Project: http://www.ucl.ac.uk/spp/research/conflict-repression To see many of my publications go to: http://ssrn.com/author=1145702 _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
I agree, and the sooner the conversation starts, the better will be the policy from which it hangs. It might be useful to invite one of the Board members who does not "get it" wrt why we are looking for human rights in the Bylaws. It will help us communicate better if we understand our failures. Stephanie Perrin On 2015-09-29 15:22, susan aaronson wrote:
I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights.
On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova)
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Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000 From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight<michele@blacknight.com> To: Stephanie Perrin<stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc:"cc-humanrights@icann.org" <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID:<6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Implementation cannot be in a vacuum Unfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked..
Mr. Michele Neylon Blacknight http://www.blacknight.irish Sent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers!
On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin<stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece. SP
On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri
Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :)
What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ?
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 12:57,"cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
good point. perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support human rights?
avri
On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial to have someone who wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?human rights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone from that side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele > -- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation & Domains >http://www.blacknight.host/ >http://blog.blacknight.com/ > http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty > Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > > On 29/09/2015 00:16,"cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Niels ten Oever" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of niels@article19.org> wrote: > Hello everyone,
Please find underneath my proposal for the draft agenda. Looking forward to hear your ideas and criticisms. I was thinking of asking more people to comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quite high. Looking forward to hear what you think.
Best,
Niels
PS I did not confirm anyone yet.
Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session ===================================
Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes
Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law (GAC WG co-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes
Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - 5 minutes
Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes
Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact assessments and CSR reporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes
Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4)
Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC)
Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC)
Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO)
Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC)
Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board)
Q&A
Summary (Marilia)
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Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400 From: Stephanie Perrin<stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> To:<cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID:<560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19 www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domainshttp://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35,"cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi,
Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw.
We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go.
And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR.
So I differentiate between
"I support hr, but ..."
and
"I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this"
avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2
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------------------------------
Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300 From: Alexandra Kulikova<alex.kulikova@gmail.com> To: Stephanie Perrin<stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: Human Rights<cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi all
There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical. They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had re blocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions.
A. On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin"<stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19 www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domainshttp://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35,"cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi,
Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw.
We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go.
And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR.
So I differentiate between
"I support hr, but ..."
and
"I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this"
avri
_______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing listcc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2
iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJWCpfgAAoJEAi1oPJjbWjp5d0IAI9by1b6mC1r7DryGEVBcQAK qJj0EAjvlj/jBXI8jBF0r94imRv5sAPKX5uVLbNXxYyhvjm1jTUijEUbKCdwFvsi QZIffACGWI8pd/sh1bGxhtK8gExdxzF9wE+7Q+ZbV4uE+iIw/TLs4tpCej6VVa6P 8/lHeJ1JcIjgdxqOM5U2Foeb6mEwLcVJOFsEbe8R5l5vItFNnh3VupOeSAoXSgeB vtCyQiKcI0NzSsf1F73tPQpjxFedr525cJk8xzBA927EUg+CvVvs+BAzvRSEMB7u oA3u9Cw0vhA9DHJUbSBZeoNN9/t8Tr65y/oxnd+FOCd05dVb5C1oBgf2hKTilzs= =0wvf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Hi Stephanie and Susan, More concrete pointers as to how you think this should be done are also very welcome in the document. https://docs.google.com/document/d/19mYpZcg-4pWRB-sKMvUNPlWU-R7oiIGIHnjY fv0JxPo/edit I think there are some very practical pointers in there. Best, Niels Niels ten Oever Head of Digital Article 19 www.article19.org PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9 On 09/29/2015 10:38 PM, Stephanie Perrin wrote:
I agree, and the sooner the conversation starts, the better will be the policy from which it hangs. It might be useful to invite one of the Board members who does not "get it" wrt why we are looking for human rights in the Bylaws. It will help us communicate better if we understand our failures. Stephanie Perrin
On 2015-09-29 15:22, susan aaronson wrote:
I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights.
On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org wrote:
Send cc-humanrights mailing list submissions to cc-humanrights@icann.org
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to cc-humanrights-request@icann.org
You can reach the person managing the list at cc-humanrights-owner@icann.org
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of cc-humanrights digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova)
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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000 From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: "cc-humanrights@icann.org" <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Implementation cannot be in a vacuum Unfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked..
Mr. Michele Neylon Blacknight http://www.blacknight.irish Sent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers!
On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece. SP
On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri
Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :)
What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ?
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 12:57, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
good point. perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support human rights?
avri
> On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: > Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial > to have someone who wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?human rights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone from that side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele >> -- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > >> Hosting, Colocation & Domains > http://www.blacknight.host/ > http://blog.blacknight.com/ > http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty > Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > > On 29/09/2015 00:16, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Niels ten Oever" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of niels@article19.org> wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > Please find underneath my proposal for the draft > agenda. Looking forward to hear your ideas and > criticisms. I was thinking of asking more people to > comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quite > high. Looking forward to hear what you think. > > Best, > > Niels > > PS I did not confirm anyone yet. > > > Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session > =================================== > > Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes > > Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law > (GAC WG co-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes > > Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - > 5 minutes > > Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes > > Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact > assessments and CSR reporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes > > Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4) > > Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC) > > Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC) > > Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO) > > Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC) > > Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board) > > Q&A > > Summary (Marilia) > > >> _______________________________________________ >> >> cc-humanrights mailing list >> >> cc-humanrights@icann.org >> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights > _______________________________________________ > cc-humanrights mailing list > cc-humanrights@icann.org > https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400 From: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> To: <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote: Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19 www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
> Hi, > > Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who > did not support a HR bylaw. > > We all have questions about how a commitment is > implemented, but i think there is a divison between > those who belive in the committment first and working > it out as we go. > > And those who want to know exactly what the future > holds before making a committment to HR. > > So I differentiate between > > "I support hr, but ..." > > and > > "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are > going to implement this" > > > avri _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300 From: Alexandra Kulikova <alex.kulikova@gmail.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi all
There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical. They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had re blocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions.
A. On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin" <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19 www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi, > Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who > did not support a HR bylaw. > > We all have questions about how a commitment is > implemented, but i think there is a divison between > those who belive in the committment first and working > it out as we go. > > And those who want to know exactly what the future > holds before making a committment to HR. > > So I differentiate between > > "I support hr, but ..." > > and > > "I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are > going to implement this" > > > avri > _______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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-- Susan Ariel Aaronson, Ph.D. Research Professor of International Affairs, Institute of International Economic Policy Elliott School of International Affairs, George Washington University http://www.gwu.edu/~elliott/faculty/aaronson.cfm
Please visit the Trade and the Internet Project Web site: http://www.gwu.edu/~iiep/signatureinitiatives/governance/taig/ The Trade, Trust, Transparency and Accountability page is: http://www.gwu.edu/~iiep/signatureinitiatives/governance/Trade_Trust_ Transparency_Accountability/
For the Repression, Civil conflict, and Leadership Tenure Project:
http://www.ucl.ac.uk/spp/research/conflict-repression
To see many of my publications go to: http://ssrn.com/author=1145702
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Hi, I don't think we are talking about individuals but about policy and institution. as reminder, the ICANN board do the oversight for the policy making process, getting recommendations from supporting organisations , approve it and direct the ICANN staff for implementation (where there is also possibility to setup implementation review team) and approve the implementation plan, as reference about policy making process, for GNSO here, please check this graphic http://gnso.icann.org/en/basics/consensus-policy/pdp which indicates the different steps and parties involved in the process we are not talking about individual responsibility here of ICANN staff or board, or about their actions to advocate or not for HR. it is really about the process itself and on how to include the provisions that can prevent situations where policies and their implementations raises legal problems from HR perspective. Best, Rafik 2015-09-30 4:22 GMT+09:00 susan aaronson <saaronson2@verizon.net>:
I made exactly that point in my comments on the document. You need to illuminate the "How" to IcANN and someone on the board has to take responsibility for the staff that will be held accountable for implementing human rights.
On 9/29/2015 3:20 PM, cc-humanrights-request@icann.org wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: draft agenda public session (Michele Neylon - Blacknight) 2. Re: draft agenda public session (Stephanie Perrin) 3. Re: draft agenda public session (Alexandra Kulikova)
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Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 18:43:10 +0000 From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> <michele@blacknight.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: "cc-humanrights@icann.org" <cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> <6E5C1185-6F94-4138-94C2-62C41F1F868F@blacknight.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Implementation cannot be in a vacuum Unfortunately with the best intentions in the world it gets overlooked..
Mr. Michele Neylon Blacknighthttp://www.blacknight.irish Sent from a small shiny object so excuse fat fingers!
On 29 Sep 2015, at 19:20, Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
concerns about implementation is a likely comment. But lets not drop Avri, lets just broaden the discussion to include some who will argue that piece. SP
On 2015-09-29 7:59, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Avri
Nobody is going to say they don?t support human rights :)
What they might say is that they have concerns about how this is handled ?
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domainshttp://www.blacknight.host/http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 12:57, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> wrote:
good point. perhaps replace me with someone from the GNSO who does not support human rights?
avri
On 29-Sep-15 05:06, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote: Niels > > Just a thought, but wouldn?t it be beneficial to have someone who
wasn?t on your side? > I know there has been pushback on the ?human rights? issue with respect to CCWG / IANA etc., and having someone from that side of the house might be more beneficial. > > Regards > > Michele
-- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation
& Domains > http://www.blacknight.host/ > http://blog.blacknight.com/ >http://ceo.hosting/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Direct Dial: +353(0)59 9183090 > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty > Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > > > > > > > > On 29/09/2015 00:16, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Niels ten Oever" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofNielstenOever> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of niels@article19.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofniels@article19.org> wrote: >
Hello everyone,
Please find underneath my proposal for the draft agenda. Looking forward to hear your ideas and criticisms. I was thinking of asking more people to comment, but I'm afraid the number is already quite high. Looking forward to hear what you think.
Best,
Niels
PS I did not confirm anyone yet.
Draft Agenda CCWP HR public session ===================================
Welcome and Introductions (Niels & Rafik) - 5 minutes
Update on GAC WG on Human Rights and International Law (GAC WG co-chairs / Lee Hibbard) - 5 minutes
Update on CCWG WP4 on human rights (Leon Sanchez) - 5 minutes
Presentation chart (Marilia) - 10 minutes
Presentation new report on Human Rights Impact assessments and CSR reporting (Motoko) - 20 minutes
Comments by Leon Sanchez (Chair CCWG WP4)
Comments by Greg Shatan (IPC)
Comments by Patrik Falstrom (SSAC)
Comments by Avri Doria (GNSO)
Comments by Olivier Crepin-Leblond (ALAC)
Comments by Wolfgang Kleinwaechter (board)
Q&A
Summary (Marilia)
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Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 14:28:39 -0400 From: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> To: <cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> <560AD857.7090501@mail.utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format=flowed
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353(0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi,
Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw.
We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go.
And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR.
So I differentiate between
"I support hr, but ..."
and
"I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this"
avri
_______________________________________________ cc-humanrights mailing list cc-humanrights@icann.orghttps://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-humanrights
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Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2015 22:19:53 +0300 From: Alexandra Kulikova <alex.kulikova@gmail.com> <alex.kulikova@gmail.com> To: Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> Cc: Human Rights <cc-humanrights@icann.org> <cc-humanrights@icann.org> Subject: Re: [cc-humanrights] draft agenda public session Message-ID: <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> <CAK0REaOGy5P2R3azZDO2KY2GGd6RZWk2WDM_Zepp1jB5LWXYgA@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi all
There was a guy from GoDaddy at the f2f on Saturday who was critical. They'd be interesting to have in the room after that hr fallout they had re blocking Crimean domains in February when forced to implement sanctions.
A. On 29 Sep 2015 21:44, "Stephanie Perrin" <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> <stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:
Joe Alhadeff, if he is around. NEed a business constituency person, I would suggest. SP On 2015-09-29 9:53, Niels ten Oever wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
Great idea Michele, that's why I proposed Greg. But happy to add others. Any suggestions for people to add? Or would you be interested in asking critical questions?
Best,
Niels
Niels ten Oever Head of Digital
Article 19www.article19.org
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4 678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9
On 09/29/2015 02:38 PM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
Avri
As a European registrar I?m very conscious that ICANN is forcing a bunch of things via policy + contract that are, essentially, illegal.
But I?d be very wary of how this kind of commitment was made. Simply committing to something and assuming it?ll be sorted out later has not proven to be a particularly sane strategy within the ICANN space..
So while I have no concrete objections to HR, I would want clarity on a variety of things before pushing hard for it.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353(0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 29/09/2015 13:35, "cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Avri Doria" <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofAvriDoria> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.org on behalf of avri@acm.org> <cc-humanrights-bounces@icann.orgonbehalfofavri@acm.org> wrote:
Hi,
Oh, I did not know you were in the group of people who did not support a HR bylaw.
We all have questions about how a commitment is implemented, but i think there is a divison between those who belive in the committment first and working it out as we go.
And those who want to know exactly what the future holds before making a committment to HR.
So I differentiate between
"I support hr, but ..."
and
"I support hr. I do think we need to discuss how we are going to implement this"
avri
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participants (7)
-
Chris LaHatte -
Coppens Pasteur NDAYIRAGIJE -
Niels ten Oever -
Nigel Hickson -
Rafik Dammak -
Stephanie Perrin -
susan aaronson