For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2
Dear All, Please find attached version 2 of the proposal for your review which includes amongst others: * Jonathan¹s edits * Paragraph 102 CWG edits * Paragraph 106 Martin addition * Paragraph 111 Martin addition * Paragraph 150 CWG edits * Paragraph 226 (Annex F) Martin addition * Paragraph 233 table Martin addition * Updated Section VI * Updates from DT F concerning root zone maintainer and root zone environment * Suggested changes to address Andrew¹s comments in paragraph 96 and 107 * Updates to Annex F * Updates to Annex J per DT M¹s feedback Please note that there are still some outstanding items that we expect to update as soon as input is received, for example from DT C concerning the CSC Charter, paragraph 123 (note action item for Avri), outstanding issue in Annex J under discussion by DT M and C, DT A input concerning Annex H, but we already wanted to give you an opportunity to review these latests updates. Furthermore, we will continue working on proofreading and formatting of the document and annexes. Please share any comments and/or edits you have with the mailing list. Best regards, Marika
Apologies, someone just pointed out I attached the wrong document. Please find attached version 2. You can ignore the document I sent you in the previous email, the work on the public comment review tool has not been completed yet. Best regards, Marika From: Marika Konings <marika.konings@icann.org> Date: Wednesday 3 June 2015 16:08 To: "cwg-stewardship@icann.org" <cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Subject: For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Dear All, Please find attached version 2 of the proposal for your review which includes amongst others: * Jonathan¹s edits * Paragraph 102 CWG edits * Paragraph 106 Martin addition * Paragraph 111 Martin addition * Paragraph 150 CWG edits * Paragraph 226 (Annex F) Martin addition * Paragraph 233 table Martin addition * Updated Section VI * Updates from DT F concerning root zone maintainer and root zone environment * Suggested changes to address Andrew¹s comments in paragraph 96 and 107 * Updates to Annex F * Updates to Annex J per DT M¹s feedback Please note that there are still some outstanding items that we expect to update as soon as input is received, for example from DT C concerning the CSC Charter, paragraph 123 (note action item for Avri), outstanding issue in Annex J under discussion by DT M and C, DT A input concerning Annex H, but we already wanted to give you an opportunity to review these latests updates. Furthermore, we will continue working on proofreading and formatting of the document and annexes. Please share any comments and/or edits you have with the mailing list. Best regards, Marika
Hi Marika, I have some comments and proposed changes to section IV. Please see attached document. Best, Lise Fra: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] På vegne af Marika Konings Sendt: 3. juni 2015 16:32 Til: cwg-stewardship@icann.org Emne: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Apologies, someone just pointed out I attached the wrong document. Please find attached version 2. You can ignore the document I sent you in the previous email, the work on the public comment review tool has not been completed yet. Best regards, Marika From: Marika Konings <marika.konings@icann.org> Date: Wednesday 3 June 2015 16:08 To: "cwg-stewardship@icann.org" <cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Subject: For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Dear All, Please find attached version 2 of the proposal for your review which includes amongst others: * Jonathans edits * Paragraph 102 CWG edits * Paragraph 106 Martin addition * Paragraph 111 Martin addition * Paragraph 150 CWG edits * Paragraph 226 (Annex F) Martin addition * Paragraph 233 table Martin addition * Updated Section VI * Updates from DT F concerning root zone maintainer and root zone environment * Suggested changes to address Andrews comments in paragraph 96 and 107 * Updates to Annex F * Updates to Annex J per DT Ms feedback Please note that there are still some outstanding items that we expect to update as soon as input is received, for example from DT C concerning the CSC Charter, paragraph 123 (note action item for Avri), outstanding issue in Annex J under discussion by DT M and C, DT A input concerning Annex H, but we already wanted to give you an opportunity to review these latests updates. Furthermore, we will continue working on proofreading and formatting of the document and annexes. Please share any comments and/or edits you have with the mailing list. Best regards, Marika
Hi Lise, Your comment on page 35: yes, like you I saw the CSC (as the name implies) specifically focussing on customer issues. The proposal brings in liaisons, but does this make it multi-stakeholder? I am concerned that we significantly amend the role of the CSC because it is seen as multi-stakeholder and other issues are of more interest to other stakeholders. There are clear roles for the wider stakeholder liaisons - which is why they are liaisons - which are about improving communications and information about the discussions in the CSC with their own community. So I would favour the deletion of the term multi-stakeholder in this paragraph and your addition. Martin From: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Lise Fuhr Sent: 04 June 2015 00:38 To: 'Marika Konings'; cwg-stewardship@icann.org Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Hi Marika, I have some comments and proposed changes to section IV. Please see attached document. Best, Lise Fra: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org> [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] På vegne af Marika Konings Sendt: 3. juni 2015 16:32 Til: cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Emne: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Apologies, someone just pointed out I attached the wrong document. Please find attached version 2. You can ignore the document I sent you in the previous email, the work on the public comment review tool has not been completed yet. Best regards, Marika From: Marika Konings <marika.konings@icann.org<mailto:marika.konings@icann.org>> Date: Wednesday 3 June 2015 16:08 To: "cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org>" <cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org>> Subject: For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Dear All, Please find attached version 2 of the proposal for your review which includes amongst others: * Jonathan's edits * Paragraph 102 - CWG edits * Paragraph 106 - Martin addition * Paragraph 111- Martin addition * Paragraph 150 - CWG edits * Paragraph 226 (Annex F) - Martin addition * Paragraph 233 table - Martin addition * Updated Section VI * Updates from DT F concerning root zone maintainer and root zone environment * Suggested changes to address Andrew's comments in paragraph 96 and 107 * Updates to Annex F * Updates to Annex J per DT M's feedback Please note that there are still some outstanding items that we expect to update as soon as input is received, for example from DT C concerning the CSC Charter, paragraph 123 (note action item for Avri), outstanding issue in Annex J under discussion by DT M and C, DT A input concerning Annex H, but we already wanted to give you an opportunity to review these latests updates. Furthermore, we will continue working on proofreading and formatting of the document and annexes. Please share any comments and/or edits you have with the mailing list. Best regards, Marika
Hi Martin I agree ! Elise Fra: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] På vegne av Martin Boyle Sendt: 4. juni 2015 10:02 Til: lisefuhrforwader; 'Marika Konings'; cwg-stewardship@icann.org Emne: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Hi Lise, Your comment on page 35: yes, like you I saw the CSC (as the name implies) specifically focussing on customer issues. The proposal brings in liaisons, but does this make it multi-stakeholder? I am concerned that we significantly amend the role of the CSC because it is seen as multi-stakeholder and other issues are of more interest to other stakeholders. There are clear roles for the wider stakeholder liaisons - which is why they are liaisons - which are about improving communications and information about the discussions in the CSC with their own community. So I would favour the deletion of the term multi-stakeholder in this paragraph and your addition. Martin From: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org> [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Lise Fuhr Sent: 04 June 2015 00:38 To: 'Marika Konings'; cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Hi Marika, I have some comments and proposed changes to section IV. Please see attached document. Best, Lise Fra: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org> [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] På vegne af Marika Konings Sendt: 3. juni 2015 16:32 Til: cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Emne: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Apologies, someone just pointed out I attached the wrong document. Please find attached version 2. You can ignore the document I sent you in the previous email, the work on the public comment review tool has not been completed yet. Best regards, Marika From: Marika Konings <marika.konings@icann.org<mailto:marika.konings@icann.org>> Date: Wednesday 3 June 2015 16:08 To: "cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org>" <cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org>> Subject: For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Dear All, Please find attached version 2 of the proposal for your review which includes amongst others: * Jonathan's edits * Paragraph 102 - CWG edits * Paragraph 106 - Martin addition * Paragraph 111- Martin addition * Paragraph 150 - CWG edits * Paragraph 226 (Annex F) - Martin addition * Paragraph 233 table - Martin addition * Updated Section VI * Updates from DT F concerning root zone maintainer and root zone environment * Suggested changes to address Andrew's comments in paragraph 96 and 107 * Updates to Annex F * Updates to Annex J per DT M's feedback Please note that there are still some outstanding items that we expect to update as soon as input is received, for example from DT C concerning the CSC Charter, paragraph 123 (note action item for Avri), outstanding issue in Annex J under discussion by DT M and C, DT A input concerning Annex H, but we already wanted to give you an opportunity to review these latests updates. Furthermore, we will continue working on proofreading and formatting of the document and annexes. Please share any comments and/or edits you have with the mailing list. Best regards, Marika
I also agree with Martin. From: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Martin Boyle Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2015 1:02 AM To: lisefuhrforwader; 'Marika Konings'; cwg-stewardship@icann.org Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Hi Lise, Your comment on page 35: yes, like you I saw the CSC (as the name implies) specifically focussing on customer issues. The proposal brings in liaisons, but does this make it multi-stakeholder? I am concerned that we significantly amend the role of the CSC because it is seen as multi-stakeholder and other issues are of more interest to other stakeholders. There are clear roles for the wider stakeholder liaisons - which is why they are liaisons - which are about improving communications and information about the discussions in the CSC with their own community. So I would favour the deletion of the term multi-stakeholder in this paragraph and your addition. Martin From: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org> [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Lise Fuhr Sent: 04 June 2015 00:38 To: 'Marika Konings'; cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Subject: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Hi Marika, I have some comments and proposed changes to section IV. Please see attached document. Best, Lise Fra: cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org> [mailto:cwg-stewardship-bounces@icann.org] På vegne af Marika Konings Sendt: 3. juni 2015 16:32 Til: cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org> Emne: Re: [CWG-Stewardship] For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Apologies, someone just pointed out I attached the wrong document. Please find attached version 2. You can ignore the document I sent you in the previous email, the work on the public comment review tool has not been completed yet. Best regards, Marika From: Marika Konings <marika.konings@icann.org<mailto:marika.konings@icann.org>> Date: Wednesday 3 June 2015 16:08 To: "cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org>" <cwg-stewardship@icann.org<mailto:cwg-stewardship@icann.org>> Subject: For your review - CWG-Stewardship Proposal v2 Dear All, Please find attached version 2 of the proposal for your review which includes amongst others: * Jonathan's edits * Paragraph 102 - CWG edits * Paragraph 106 - Martin addition * Paragraph 111- Martin addition * Paragraph 150 - CWG edits * Paragraph 226 (Annex F) - Martin addition * Paragraph 233 table - Martin addition * Updated Section VI * Updates from DT F concerning root zone maintainer and root zone environment * Suggested changes to address Andrew's comments in paragraph 96 and 107 * Updates to Annex F * Updates to Annex J per DT M's feedback Please note that there are still some outstanding items that we expect to update as soon as input is received, for example from DT C concerning the CSC Charter, paragraph 123 (note action item for Avri), outstanding issue in Annex J under discussion by DT M and C, DT A input concerning Annex H, but we already wanted to give you an opportunity to review these latests updates. Furthermore, we will continue working on proofreading and formatting of the document and annexes. Please share any comments and/or edits you have with the mailing list. Best regards, Marika
Hi, This is the first of a series of individual comments on the v2 document. They represent individual responses to pieces that I thought would be self contained. I am writing as I go through the document, and I'll go through until I run out of time (or energy, which I guess at some abstract level has an uncertain relationship, but I stopped trying to understant quantum mechanics before that chapter). The goal in each message is to try to provide concrete text suggestions. As a general remark, I observe that the paragraph numbering in my copy does not seem to be perfectly preserved, so I'll try to provide as much context as I can. I note that in III, the approach has been altered such that the proposal moves all IANA functions. There are, however, still some adjustments needed. In III.A.i.103, bullet 1, it says "A contract similar to the current NTIA IANA Functions Contract to perform the IANA Functions post-transition;" This isn't quite true, however, because the proposal is really about the ability "to perform the IANA names-related functions post-transition". To that you could add, "(Other IANA functions would also need to be covered, but the mechanism for that coverage is outside the scope of this proposal.)" At least, I think this is right. The alternative is to say that PTI would need all IANA functions to be covered, but that the CWG is indifferent as to whether it is one contract with ICANN, that then recontracts some of those functions out to the other communities; or whether the individual communities contract directly with PTI. Similarly in the last bullet there, there is, "The ability for the multistakeholder community to require, if necessary and after substantial opportunities for remediation, the selection of a new operator for the IANA Functions." This seems to me to be at least problematic. I do not believe that all the different kinds of stakeholders are necessarily going to be involved in decisions about every IANA function. So, here's how I'd redo that section according to what I think the CWG's proposal was: ---%<---cut here--- In order to meet community expectations for the stewardship of the naming related IANA Functions, the CWG-Stewardship, working on the premise that there is current satisfaction with ICANN’s IANA department performance and that ICANN should remain the IANA Functions Operator, agreed that a transition proposal for the names community would require the following elements: • A contract similar to the current NTIA IANA Functions Contract to perform the IANA names functions post-transition; • The ability for the multistakeholder community to ensure that ICANN acts according to community requests with respect to IANA names operations; • Additional insulation, as needed, between operational and policymaking responsibilities and protections for the IFO; • A mechanism to approve changes to the Root Zone environment (with NTIA no longer providing oversight); • The ability to ensure that the IANA Functions are adequately funded by ICANN; • The ability for the multistakeholder community to require, if necessary and after substantial opportunities for remediation, the selection of a new operator for the IANA Functions as they relate to names. It should be noted that this proposal is restricted to names, but it expects all IANA functions are expected to move to PTI. It is not clear as of this writing whether other operational communities would undertake a contract directly with PTI similar to that into which ICANN would enter, or whether those communities would have a contract with ICANN. In the event of the former, those communities would need to work out an agreement with PTI for the support of the respective functions. In the event of the latter, any such contract would be with ICANN, which would then subcontract the function to PTI. The details of which of these is chosen is irrelevant for the purposes of the present proposal, so long as those details are not inconsistent with this proposal. In any case, the arrangements for the non-names IANA functions are out of scope for this document except to the extent they impinge directly on the names functions. --->%---cut here--- -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com
NITS I note that there remains a number of areas where formatting is troublesome. The paragraph numbering itself has, alas, made this appear even worse, because instead of it having been applied in a different font or clearly marked off or something, it appears to be running numbering. This isn't a criticism of the staff (though it is a criticism of Word, which seems to me to be the wrong tool for every job), but it'll need to be fixed for the final version. There are several places where it unfortunately obscures meaning (e.g. section I.A number 9 is I think a header that ought to cover what's #10 in the version before me, for instance). II.A.i.24 says "static document (RFCs are updated by the issuance of a new RFC) there have been two significant…". I suspect a new sentence starts at "there". II.B.55 says "One of the official accountability mechanism…" "mechanisms" for number agreement. IV.B.189 [include ref] (need to fill reference) V.B.212 There's a note here "This needs to be settled for final proposal", but I don't understand it. Annx F.290 "…that had submitted expressions." I think a word got chopped. (I'm giggling thinking of someone submitting pictures of various frowny faces and so on. Clearly, I've been reading this too long.) Best regards, A -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com
In this section, the question is how long the proposals are going to take to complete, and it doesn't seem the question is being asked. In particular, in ¶ 200, it might be good to get some ball park estimates. So, for instance, for PTI, "Normal time for incorporation and approval of a public-benefit company as an affiliate takes [n-n+m] months." For CSC, perhaps some similar evidence for how long it normally takes for ICANN to agree on how to set up a standing committee. I suggest that the length of time that it took from the announcement of the creation of CWG-Stewardship until its complete population with all its members (not participants) might be a good example time. For the ICANN-PTI contract, perhaps use as a rough guide the amount of time it took the NTIA and ICANN to come to terms last time? Just some suggestions. I don't feel strongly about these, but they'd make the response more complete. A -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com
On Wed, Jun 03, 2015 at 07:22:33PM -0400, Andrew Sullivan wrote:
In this section, the question is how long the proposals are going to take to complete, and it doesn't seem the question is being asked.
Um, "answered", of course. Sorry. A -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com
Hi, The sample term sheet in Annex S in the cost/price section includes "the IETF, the IAB, 5 RIRs;" in square brackets. Is that to indicate that the relevant inclusions would depend on what contractual relationships were in place? In any case, this section appears to be at odds with previous ones, that claim that PTI is supported entirely by ICANN and that ICANN is the one doing the charging. I don't have specific text, but I think it ought to be made consistent. In the "separation" section, the term there has caused the IETF (and, I might suggest, this very CWG) a certain amount of grief, because under the most broad interpretation it excludes the capable and informed IANA staff from telling anyone anything about how stuff actually works. That's clearly not what we want. How about this: ---%<---cut here--- PTI staff members will not initiate, advance, or advocate any policy development related to the IANA functions. This section shall not be construed to prevent contributions by staff members by way either of background information or direct text contribution to any document, provided both that the PTI staff are not the only authors of the contribution and that the primary function of the staff member's contribution is in supplying relevant IANA experience and insight. --->%---cut here--- Or anyway, something along those lines. Best regards, A -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com
participants (6)
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Andrew Sullivan -
Donna Austin -
Lindeberg, Elise -
Lise Fuhr -
Marika Konings -
Martin Boyle