Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed approachfor reviewing public comments
If the PSWG want to be taken seriously they need to submit comments within the proper timelines The comment period closed on July 7th. It’s now July 23rd, so I don’t see how their comments can be accepted at this juncture. Or if they are accepted they should not be considered to be part of the comment period, as they did not submit them as part of it. While I also think it would be good to get LEA input I don’t see why PSWG cannot respect the timelines that everyone else has to work to Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://www.blacknight.press - get our latest news & media coverage http://www.technology.ie Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 Social: http://mneylon.social Random Stuff: http://michele.irish ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 23/07/2015 11:00, "Victoria Sheckler" <vsheckler@riaa.com> wrote:
I believe their comments are forthcoming.
-----Original Message----- From: gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Mary Wong Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2015 12:19 PM To: Kiran Malancharuvil; Michele Neylon - Blacknight Cc: gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org Subject: Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed approachfor reviewing public comments
Hello Kiran and everyone,
The PSWG did not seem to have submitted their comments to the PPSAI public comments forum. I checked around internally and do not think they sent it in or published it. As such, ICANN policy staff doesn¹t have any records or copies of it and so whatever PSWG statement was drafted has not been included or reflected in our documents, including the various templates comprising the Public Comment Review Tool.
Cheers Mary
Mary Wong Senior Policy Director Internet Corporation for Assigned Names & Numbers (ICANN) Telephone: +1 603 574 4889 Email: mary.wong@icann.org
-----Original Message----- From: <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Kiran Malancharuvil <Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com> Date: Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 11:58 To: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> Cc: "gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org" <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org> Subject: Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed approachfor reviewing public comments
Good question. Since I was loathe to sort through zillions of pages looking for the comments I wanted to read initially, I requested the comments directly from Bobby and he emailed them to me. I don't think Dick has access to this list anymore, but I will ask them to forward a link or attachment and I will pass it along?
K
Kiran Malancharuvil Policy Counselor MarkMonitor 415-419-9138 (m)
Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos.
On Jul 22, 2015, at 1:15 AM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> wrote:
Does anyone have a link to their submission?
I know they were drafting one, but I don¹t recall seeing it
Regards
Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://www.blacknight.press - get our latest news & media coverage http://www.technology.ie Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 Social: http://mneylon.social Random Stuff: http://www.michele.irish/ ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 22/07/2015 04:59, "gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Kiran Malancharuvil" <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com> wrote:
Barry,
Thanks for your comments. I think you would be interested in the past interventions of Dick Leaning, who was the LE representative on this group until his retirement from Europol on July 1st of this year, and in the public safety working group comment drafted by Bobby Flaim from the FBI and Loreen Kapin from the FTC (with Dick's input). They have statedon multiple occasions that getting a warrant isn't a 15 minute thing. I'll let them speak for themselves but suffice to say that they prefer a system that doesn't require a warrant.
Anyway, I just wanted to point out that they've given their recommendations formally.
Happy lurking!
Kiran
Kiran Malancharuvil Policy Counselor MarkMonitor 415-419-9138 (m)
Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos.
On Jul 21, 2015, at 8:12 PM, Barry Shein <bzs@world.std.com> wrote:
I apologize for posting at all since I'm not much involved but I'm sort of surprised at the level of speculation about law enforcement.
As an ISP I've been in the middle of this sort of thing.
In a nutshell there are large and huge and tiny LEAs and they're all quite different in their response.
I've dealt with the FBI who can turn out a proper warrant in about 15 minutes and college campus police (colleges you've heard of) who could be incredibly unprofessional -- one threatened, and I mean angrily threatened, that if I didn't produce the credentials immediately (I stood my ground for a warrant, it was basically cyberstalking) they would "show up at my office". I said they were welcome, I'd make the coffee, and got in touch with the university's general counsel. I could post that interchange but as you can imagine they were horribly embarrassed.
Why not get someone from an LEA or two involved even informally rather than speculate?
So much of this is in the name of law enforcement yet my impression is that law enforcement per se hasn't been engaged.
A DA wouldn't hurt either since they have to build the cases and wield the prosecutorial discretion which is really what you're ultimately trying to support.
Sorry, I'll go back to lurking.
-- -Barry Shein
The World | bzs@TheWorld.com | http://www.TheWorld.com Purveyors to the Trade | Voice: 800-THE-WRLD | Dial-Up: US, PR, Canada Software Tool & Die | Public Access Internet | SINCE 1989 *oo* _______________________________________________ Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg
Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg
Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg
I can't account for their failure to submit since I saw a final draft before the deadline. We will have to wait to see what they say. K Kiran Malancharuvil Policy Counselor MarkMonitor 415-419-9138 (m) Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos.
On Jul 23, 2015, at 3:09 AM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> wrote:
If the PSWG want to be taken seriously they need to submit comments within the proper timelines
The comment period closed on July 7th. It’s now July 23rd, so I don’t see how their comments can be accepted at this juncture. Or if they are accepted they should not be considered to be part of the comment period, as they did not submit them as part of it.
While I also think it would be good to get LEA input I don’t see why PSWG cannot respect the timelines that everyone else has to work to
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://www.blacknight.press - get our latest news & media coverage http://www.technology.ie Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 Social: http://mneylon.social Random Stuff: http://michele.irish ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 23/07/2015 11:00, "Victoria Sheckler" <vsheckler@riaa.com> wrote:
I believe their comments are forthcoming.
-----Original Message----- From: gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org] On Behalf Of Mary Wong Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2015 12:19 PM To: Kiran Malancharuvil; Michele Neylon - Blacknight Cc: gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org Subject: Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed approachfor reviewing public comments
Hello Kiran and everyone,
The PSWG did not seem to have submitted their comments to the PPSAI public comments forum. I checked around internally and do not think they sent it in or published it. As such, ICANN policy staff doesn¹t have any records or copies of it and so whatever PSWG statement was drafted has not been included or reflected in our documents, including the various templates comprising the Public Comment Review Tool.
Cheers Mary
Mary Wong Senior Policy Director Internet Corporation for Assigned Names & Numbers (ICANN) Telephone: +1 603 574 4889 Email: mary.wong@icann.org
-----Original Message----- From: <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org> on behalf of Kiran Malancharuvil <Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com> Date: Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 11:58 To: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> Cc: "gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org" <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org> Subject: Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed approachfor reviewing public comments
Good question. Since I was loathe to sort through zillions of pages looking for the comments I wanted to read initially, I requested the comments directly from Bobby and he emailed them to me. I don't think Dick has access to this list anymore, but I will ask them to forward a link or attachment and I will pass it along?
K
Kiran Malancharuvil Policy Counselor MarkMonitor 415-419-9138 (m)
Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos.
On Jul 22, 2015, at 1:15 AM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> wrote:
Does anyone have a link to their submission?
I know they were drafting one, but I don¹t recall seeing it
Regards
Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains http://www.blacknight.host/ http://blog.blacknight.com/ http://www.blacknight.press - get our latest news & media coverage http://www.technology.ie Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 Social: http://mneylon.social Random Stuff: http://www.michele.irish/ ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
On 22/07/2015 04:59, "gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Kiran Malancharuvil" <gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org on behalf of Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com> wrote:
Barry,
Thanks for your comments. I think you would be interested in the past interventions of Dick Leaning, who was the LE representative on this group until his retirement from Europol on July 1st of this year, and in the public safety working group comment drafted by Bobby Flaim from the FBI and Loreen Kapin from the FTC (with Dick's input). They have statedon multiple occasions that getting a warrant isn't a 15 minute thing. I'll let them speak for themselves but suffice to say that they prefer a system that doesn't require a warrant.
Anyway, I just wanted to point out that they've given their recommendations formally.
Happy lurking!
Kiran
Kiran Malancharuvil Policy Counselor MarkMonitor 415-419-9138 (m)
Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos.
On Jul 21, 2015, at 8:12 PM, Barry Shein <bzs@world.std.com> wrote:
I apologize for posting at all since I'm not much involved but I'm sort of surprised at the level of speculation about law enforcement.
As an ISP I've been in the middle of this sort of thing.
In a nutshell there are large and huge and tiny LEAs and they're all quite different in their response.
I've dealt with the FBI who can turn out a proper warrant in about 15 minutes and college campus police (colleges you've heard of) who could be incredibly unprofessional -- one threatened, and I mean angrily threatened, that if I didn't produce the credentials immediately (I stood my ground for a warrant, it was basically cyberstalking) they would "show up at my office". I said they were welcome, I'd make the coffee, and got in touch with the university's general counsel. I could post that interchange but as you can imagine they were horribly embarrassed.
Why not get someone from an LEA or two involved even informally rather than speculate?
So much of this is in the name of law enforcement yet my impression is that law enforcement per se hasn't been engaged.
A DA wouldn't hurt either since they have to build the cases and wield the prosecutorial discretion which is really what you're ultimately trying to support.
Sorry, I'll go back to lurking.
-- -Barry Shein
The World | bzs@TheWorld.com | http://www.TheWorld.com Purveyors to the Trade | Voice: 800-THE-WRLD | Dial-Up: US, PR, Canada Software Tool & Die | Public Access Internet | SINCE 1989 *oo* _______________________________________________ Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg
Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg
Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg
participants (2)
-
Kiran Malancharuvil -
Michele Neylon - Blacknight