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Red Cross Names Informal Discussion
by Michelle DeSmyter Oct. 23, 2017

Oct. 23, 2017

Dear Colleagues, We will be having an informal meeting to continue the discussion about principles and criteria for inclusion on a definitive list of protected Red Cross names which will take place on Monday, 30 October 2017 from 13:30pm - 14:30pm (GST) local time. There will be no Adobe Connect room for this meeting. As soon as we receive confirmation on the location of the meeting room we will send out the updated calendar invite. We wanted to make sure you have this date on your calendar so you would be able to plan accordingly, thank you so much! Kind regards, Michelle DeSmyter GNSO & GDD SO/AC Support coordinator Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) Email:michelle.desmyter@icann.org

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CONFIRMED: time and date for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi about Red Cross names
by Mary Wong Oct. 23, 2017

Oct. 23, 2017

Hello again everyone, Having consulted with Thomas, and in view of the fact that people are already beginning to travel to Abu Dhabi as well as calendars that are filling up rapidly, we wish to confirm that the informal meeting to continue the discussion about principles and criteria for inclusion on a definitive list of protected Red Cross names will take place on Monday 30 October, from 13.30-14.30 Abu Dhabi time, for 60 minutes. We will follow up with a calendar invitation shortly, as well as with further details as to the location at the meeting venue where this meeting will take place and the availability of a telephone connection. We hope those who indicated they are free at this time will still be able to attend, and that at least some of those who have not been able to fill in the survey will as well. Thanks and cheers Mary From: Mary Wong <mary.wong(a)icann.org> Date: Monday, October 23, 2017 at 11:10 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Subject: Please FILL IN: Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi Dear all, In order to assist us with finding an appropriate time and day for the proposed informal meeting in Abu Dhabi, to continue discussion on the criteria and principles for the Red Cross names list, please be so kind as to fill out the Doodle poll on your availability (and to indicate if you are not going to be there in person so we can try to find a room with at least telephone functionality): https://icannorg.doodle.com/poll/w4xrnmw79a49u8mm Thank you! Cheers Mary From: Mary Wong <mary.wong(a)icann.org> Date: Thursday, October 19, 2017 at 17:35 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Subject: Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi Dear all, Please be so kind as to fill in this Doodle poll if you will be in Abu Dhabi and would like to attend an informal meeting to continue the discussions: https://icannorg.doodle.com/poll/w4xrnmw79a49u8mm Please note the following: * At this stage, we are not able to secure a room that will have remote participation facilities. It is possible (though not guaranteed) that we can get a room with a telephone, in which case we may be able to offer dial-ins (audio only; there will not be any Adobe Connect functionality, recordings or transcripts). * As such, if you will not be in Abu Dhabi but wish to participate via telephone, feel free to go ahead and indicate your availability – but please put in a comment at the bottom of the poll so that we know you can only participate telephonically. * If we are able to find a slot that works for most members, staff will take notes at the meeting and report back to the full Working Group. As Thomas noted on our last call, this will be an informal meeting and therefore no decisions will be taken. Thanks and cheers Mary From: Mary Wong <mary.wong(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 18:44 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Subject: Action Items & Notes from the call today for the reconvened PDP Working Group on Red Cross names Dear all, Here are the Action Items and Notes from the call that was held earlier today; as Julie has noted (below), the MP3 recording is already available. We will post it and the transcript (when available) to the Working Group wiki space noted in Julie’s message. ACTION ITEMS: * Staff to circulate Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi – as this proposed meeting will be informal, with no remote participation facilities available, no decisions will be made and the proceedings will be reported back to the full WG for further discussion. * Working Group to continue to discuss possible principles for determining what names go on the definitive list to be implemented – based on the initial suggestions from the Red Cross representatives and the notes of the discussion from today (see below). NOTES: * The original PDP recommendation related to the following Red Cross identifiers (termed “Scope 2 Identifiers” in the Working Group’s Final Report): 189 recognized National Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; International Committee of the Red Cross; International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; ICRC, CICR, CICV, MKKK, IFRC, FICR (National Society names protected in English, as well as in their respective national languages; ICRC & IFRC identifiers protected in the 6 United Nations languages). * The scope of this reconvened Working Group does not extend to considering acronyms - we have been tasked to consider the specific Red Cross names at issue. * The contents of the current list of Red Cross identifiers placed under interim reservation by the Board are likely to change once this Working Group’s proposals are accepted. Discussion of Possible Principles for Defining the Final List of Names: * For the International Movement - Full Match of the following, in the six official UN languages: * International Committee of the Red Cross * International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies * POSSIBLE ADDITION (also in UN6): International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement? International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent? * For the National Societies - * What is a "usual name" (as proposed by the Red Cross in Stephane’s most recent email)? This needs to be clarified and understood - is there a formal list? The Council's direction was for a specific and finite set of names, with specified limited variants. * One possibility is to limit the list to "official (full) names" - in their respective national language(s); however, the concept of "usual names" can be refined, e.g. "commonly used". * No objection to including "usual names" as long as the meaning is clearly understood, and there can be a finite list (Note: By "usual" name this is normally the Society name without the word "Society" without the addition of the article "The"). * It may be clearer to use the phrase "official and commonly known names" instead; however, is there a way to ensure that this is specific enough i.e. a definitive list? Can we use something like the TMCH requirement of demonstrating "use"? Alternatively, for "commonly known", can we use the criteria in the additional draft principles suggested by the Red Cross? * Discussion to continue on this topic, and the additional suggested draft principles submitted by the Red Cross representatives. Thanks and cheers Mary From: <gnso-igo-ingo-bounces(a)icann.org> on behalf of Julie Bisland <julie.bisland(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 13:30 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Cc: "gnso-secs(a)icann.org" <gnso-secs(a)icann.org> Subject: [Gnso-igo-ingo] Recordings, Attendance & AC Chat for IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDS PDP WG on Red Cross Names on 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Dear all, Please find the attendance attached, and the mp3, Adobe Connect recording and AC Chat below for the reconvened IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Red Cross Names held on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC. Mp3: https://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-18oct17-en.mp3[audio.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__audio.icann.org_gnso_g…> AC recording: https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/<https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=ba32205baa7d5c6f…> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group…> Mailing list archive: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-igo-ingo/ Agenda Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/ApJEB[community.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_…> ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Thank you. Kind regards, Julie ——————————————— Adobe Connect chat transcript for 18 October 2017 Julie Bisland:Welcome to the Reconvened IGO INGO PDP Working Group on Red Cross names call on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Julie Bisland:Agenda wiki page: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_… Thomas Rickert:HI alll, one moment , please! Osvaldo Novoa:hello all, I am in Brazil in a hotel with a very slow WiFi, so my access is somewhat limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):sorry - coming in late Mary Wong:No worries, Thomas - we're a team! Mary Wong:Here is the link from Berry's email: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_sites_de… Mary Wong:And note that these Red Cross names are reserved on an interim basis until the issue is resolved, which is what our reconvened WG has been tasked to try to do. Jeff Neuman:Just to confirm - the list at that link - is that the list of currently protected names, or the list they want protected Mary Wong:Current Julie Bisland:Stephane, you should be able to speak into phone, as it is unmuted Julie Bisland:maybe move on while the operator troubleshoots his line Mary Wong:@Jeff, it is possible that the final list will look somewhat different from what is at the current link. Hankins:Sorry for this please go ahead... Berry Cobb:@Jeff, the link is what is currently protected. The attached word doc was a list at a first attempt to reconcile the names. Berry Cobb:@Jeff, those acronyms and out of scope for this reconvened group. Berry Cobb:"are" not and Berry Cobb:Apologies to the WG. I have contractors directly behind me with too much noise to contribute via audio. Mary Wong:@Jeff, the list is currently what is (temporarily) reserved - that is why they are in the document marked up by Stephane and his team. Jeff Neuman:But acronymns are on both lists Jeff Neuman:both the list from Berry as well as the one from Stephane Mary Wong:At the moment, yes - b/c they were reserved per Board direction on an interim basis. Mary Wong:We only have that one list at the moment - we don't yet have a list FROM this group since we haven't agreed on the formula and criteria. Jeff Neuman:Under the GNSO policy that we passed, what is the list of names that would be protected. That is what I would like to see Jeff Neuman:not the ones that are currently protected by the Board Jeff Neuman:or the ones proposed Mary Wong:@Jeff - we don't have a full list of those, with their DNS labels and language variants - since those were NOT adopted by the Board (hence our work here in this group), and so have NOT moved into implementation. Jeff Neuman:Thanks Mary, I have my hand raised Jeff Neuman:to discuss Mary Wong:You're welcome! So, basically all we have as an implementable list (which is what is on screen here) is the list of a few RC identifiers that were approved under the original PDP (Page 1), and the rest of the list is the TEMPORARY reserved list (which is why acronyms are included, but which is NOT expected to be the final list coming out of our work). Hopefully that helps. Julie Bisland:reminder: please mute Mary Wong:Stephane also had a number of comments and specific questions in his email that we have not extracted for this document, but we have them ready for discussion if needed. Berry Cobb:I'd just like to point out that the use of "hypens" is a part of that algrorithm when we convert the formal names. So that is automatic in that regard. Mary Wong:I believe Stephane is referring to this part of his email: "Names already included by the Board in the list of reserved names such as “magen david adom”, “red star of david”, but also “international red cross and red crescent movement” in the 6 UN languages (that is the Statutory name endorsed by the States), etc. " Mary Wong:Done, Thomas Jeff Neuman:So, adding the word "movement" to all of them? Jeff Neuman:So long as we are just talking in terms of full names and not abbreviations, I guess no issues Hankins:Mary - I am referring to the name "International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent", that is the statutory name of the Movement / endorsed by States Jeff Neuman:internationalredandcrossredcrescentmovement (Is that more than 63 characters?) Berry Cobb:63 Char issues will be an output of the algorithm. This discussion is about which formal designations will be reservered. Berry Cobb:Should they be >63, they will not be added to any future reserved list Jeff Neuman:internationalmovementoftheredcrossandredcrescent.TLD Jeff Neuman:I hear you Berry....I just like to visualize Jeff Neuman:Lets just make sure we are really precise in the principle Berry Cobb:Time check - 15 minutes. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):We need to protect usual names - although this is a criterion it would take form of a finite number of names pursuant to the list produced by the ICRC Mason Cole:Thomas, should it be defined as the official "full" name for avoidance of doubt? Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry, I have to leave now. I will read the transcript. Best regards. Thomas Rickert:bye Osvaldo Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Jeff: I will leave that to Stephane -but we should avoid a chicken and egg problem as in the end the criterion will be complemented with a finite list the way I understand this effort Jeff Neuman:Right....so if the official name is "American National Red Cross", but the "usual name" is "American Red Cross", I think that is fine. Jeff Neuman:Can we change "usual" to "commonly known" Mary Wong:I've tried to capture all this in the chat, Jeff Mary Wong:Notes, I mean, sorry Jeff Neuman:I think there is yes Mary Wong:We will need a specific list to implement - possibly with a clear formula to update, but it can't be open ended. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel staff would need to rely on the info offered by the ICRC, which I presume will be reasonably limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):the burden on the ICRC should be proportionate and reasonable Jeff Neuman:Jorge - I am not saying this is a huge burden. If it is a "usual" name, then how hard would it be to point to examples Jeff Neuman:In other words...for American Red Cross, you just have to say "look at Redcross.org" Jeff Neuman:That's not a burden Jeff Neuman:For British Red Cross, look at "https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.redcross.org.uk_&d=…" Mary Wong:From the staff side, we request that ICANN not be placed in the position of making decisions as to what goes and what does not go on the list. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Thomas: if you invite us for a good coffee, I'll be there ;-) Mary Wong:We will send a Doodle poll if that is beetter Jeff Neuman:Mary - using the examples I provided, I think we can both affirmatively state that ICANN wil not be in tough position Jeff Neuman:But if the Board wants us to revise out policies, staff should be willing to take on additional responsibilities Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):we have to balance trust and burden of proof... Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):thanks all and bye! avri doria:bye

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Please FILL IN: Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi
by Mary Wong Oct. 23, 2017

Oct. 23, 2017

Dear all, In order to assist us with finding an appropriate time and day for the proposed informal meeting in Abu Dhabi, to continue discussion on the criteria and principles for the Red Cross names list, please be so kind as to fill out the Doodle poll on your availability (and to indicate if you are not going to be there in person so we can try to find a room with at least telephone functionality): https://icannorg.doodle.com/poll/w4xrnmw79a49u8mm Thank you! Cheers Mary From: Mary Wong <mary.wong(a)icann.org> Date: Thursday, October 19, 2017 at 17:35 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Subject: Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi Dear all, Please be so kind as to fill in this Doodle poll if you will be in Abu Dhabi and would like to attend an informal meeting to continue the discussions: https://icannorg.doodle.com/poll/w4xrnmw79a49u8mm Please note the following: * At this stage, we are not able to secure a room that will have remote participation facilities. It is possible (though not guaranteed) that we can get a room with a telephone, in which case we may be able to offer dial-ins (audio only; there will not be any Adobe Connect functionality, recordings or transcripts). * As such, if you will not be in Abu Dhabi but wish to participate via telephone, feel free to go ahead and indicate your availability – but please put in a comment at the bottom of the poll so that we know you can only participate telephonically. * If we are able to find a slot that works for most members, staff will take notes at the meeting and report back to the full Working Group. As Thomas noted on our last call, this will be an informal meeting and therefore no decisions will be taken. Thanks and cheers Mary From: Mary Wong <mary.wong(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 18:44 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Subject: Action Items & Notes from the call today for the reconvened PDP Working Group on Red Cross names Dear all, Here are the Action Items and Notes from the call that was held earlier today; as Julie has noted (below), the MP3 recording is already available. We will post it and the transcript (when available) to the Working Group wiki space noted in Julie’s message. ACTION ITEMS: * Staff to circulate Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi – as this proposed meeting will be informal, with no remote participation facilities available, no decisions will be made and the proceedings will be reported back to the full WG for further discussion. * Working Group to continue to discuss possible principles for determining what names go on the definitive list to be implemented – based on the initial suggestions from the Red Cross representatives and the notes of the discussion from today (see below). NOTES: * The original PDP recommendation related to the following Red Cross identifiers (termed “Scope 2 Identifiers” in the Working Group’s Final Report): 189 recognized National Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; International Committee of the Red Cross; International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; ICRC, CICR, CICV, MKKK, IFRC, FICR (National Society names protected in English, as well as in their respective national languages; ICRC & IFRC identifiers protected in the 6 United Nations languages). * The scope of this reconvened Working Group does not extend to considering acronyms - we have been tasked to consider the specific Red Cross names at issue. * The contents of the current list of Red Cross identifiers placed under interim reservation by the Board are likely to change once this Working Group’s proposals are accepted. Discussion of Possible Principles for Defining the Final List of Names: * For the International Movement - Full Match of the following, in the six official UN languages: * International Committee of the Red Cross * International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies * POSSIBLE ADDITION (also in UN6): International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement? International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent? * For the National Societies - * What is a "usual name" (as proposed by the Red Cross in Stephane’s most recent email)? This needs to be clarified and understood - is there a formal list? The Council's direction was for a specific and finite set of names, with specified limited variants. * One possibility is to limit the list to "official (full) names" - in their respective national language(s); however, the concept of "usual names" can be refined, e.g. "commonly used". * No objection to including "usual names" as long as the meaning is clearly understood, and there can be a finite list (Note: By "usual" name this is normally the Society name without the word "Society" without the addition of the article "The"). * It may be clearer to use the phrase "official and commonly known names" instead; however, is there a way to ensure that this is specific enough i.e. a definitive list? Can we use something like the TMCH requirement of demonstrating "use"? Alternatively, for "commonly known", can we use the criteria in the additional draft principles suggested by the Red Cross? * Discussion to continue on this topic, and the additional suggested draft principles submitted by the Red Cross representatives. Thanks and cheers Mary From: <gnso-igo-ingo-bounces(a)icann.org> on behalf of Julie Bisland <julie.bisland(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 13:30 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Cc: "gnso-secs(a)icann.org" <gnso-secs(a)icann.org> Subject: [Gnso-igo-ingo] Recordings, Attendance & AC Chat for IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDS PDP WG on Red Cross Names on 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Dear all, Please find the attendance attached, and the mp3, Adobe Connect recording and AC Chat below for the reconvened IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Red Cross Names held on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC. Mp3: https://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-18oct17-en.mp3[audio.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__audio.icann.org_gnso_g…> AC recording: https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/<https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=ba32205baa7d5c6f…> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group…> Mailing list archive: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-igo-ingo/ Agenda Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/ApJEB[community.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_…> ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Thank you. Kind regards, Julie ——————————————— Adobe Connect chat transcript for 18 October 2017 Julie Bisland:Welcome to the Reconvened IGO INGO PDP Working Group on Red Cross names call on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Julie Bisland:Agenda wiki page: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_… Thomas Rickert:HI alll, one moment , please! Osvaldo Novoa:hello all, I am in Brazil in a hotel with a very slow WiFi, so my access is somewhat limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):sorry - coming in late Mary Wong:No worries, Thomas - we're a team! Mary Wong:Here is the link from Berry's email: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_sites_de… Mary Wong:And note that these Red Cross names are reserved on an interim basis until the issue is resolved, which is what our reconvened WG has been tasked to try to do. Jeff Neuman:Just to confirm - the list at that link - is that the list of currently protected names, or the list they want protected Mary Wong:Current Julie Bisland:Stephane, you should be able to speak into phone, as it is unmuted Julie Bisland:maybe move on while the operator troubleshoots his line Mary Wong:@Jeff, it is possible that the final list will look somewhat different from what is at the current link. Hankins:Sorry for this please go ahead... Berry Cobb:@Jeff, the link is what is currently protected. The attached word doc was a list at a first attempt to reconcile the names. Berry Cobb:@Jeff, those acronyms and out of scope for this reconvened group. Berry Cobb:"are" not and Berry Cobb:Apologies to the WG. I have contractors directly behind me with too much noise to contribute via audio. Mary Wong:@Jeff, the list is currently what is (temporarily) reserved - that is why they are in the document marked up by Stephane and his team. Jeff Neuman:But acronymns are on both lists Jeff Neuman:both the list from Berry as well as the one from Stephane Mary Wong:At the moment, yes - b/c they were reserved per Board direction on an interim basis. Mary Wong:We only have that one list at the moment - we don't yet have a list FROM this group since we haven't agreed on the formula and criteria. Jeff Neuman:Under the GNSO policy that we passed, what is the list of names that would be protected. That is what I would like to see Jeff Neuman:not the ones that are currently protected by the Board Jeff Neuman:or the ones proposed Mary Wong:@Jeff - we don't have a full list of those, with their DNS labels and language variants - since those were NOT adopted by the Board (hence our work here in this group), and so have NOT moved into implementation. Jeff Neuman:Thanks Mary, I have my hand raised Jeff Neuman:to discuss Mary Wong:You're welcome! So, basically all we have as an implementable list (which is what is on screen here) is the list of a few RC identifiers that were approved under the original PDP (Page 1), and the rest of the list is the TEMPORARY reserved list (which is why acronyms are included, but which is NOT expected to be the final list coming out of our work). Hopefully that helps. Julie Bisland:reminder: please mute Mary Wong:Stephane also had a number of comments and specific questions in his email that we have not extracted for this document, but we have them ready for discussion if needed. Berry Cobb:I'd just like to point out that the use of "hypens" is a part of that algrorithm when we convert the formal names. So that is automatic in that regard. Mary Wong:I believe Stephane is referring to this part of his email: "Names already included by the Board in the list of reserved names such as “magen david adom”, “red star of david”, but also “international red cross and red crescent movement” in the 6 UN languages (that is the Statutory name endorsed by the States), etc. " Mary Wong:Done, Thomas Jeff Neuman:So, adding the word "movement" to all of them? Jeff Neuman:So long as we are just talking in terms of full names and not abbreviations, I guess no issues Hankins:Mary - I am referring to the name "International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent", that is the statutory name of the Movement / endorsed by States Jeff Neuman:internationalredandcrossredcrescentmovement (Is that more than 63 characters?) Berry Cobb:63 Char issues will be an output of the algorithm. This discussion is about which formal designations will be reservered. Berry Cobb:Should they be >63, they will not be added to any future reserved list Jeff Neuman:internationalmovementoftheredcrossandredcrescent.TLD Jeff Neuman:I hear you Berry....I just like to visualize Jeff Neuman:Lets just make sure we are really precise in the principle Berry Cobb:Time check - 15 minutes. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):We need to protect usual names - although this is a criterion it would take form of a finite number of names pursuant to the list produced by the ICRC Mason Cole:Thomas, should it be defined as the official "full" name for avoidance of doubt? Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry, I have to leave now. I will read the transcript. Best regards. Thomas Rickert:bye Osvaldo Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Jeff: I will leave that to Stephane -but we should avoid a chicken and egg problem as in the end the criterion will be complemented with a finite list the way I understand this effort Jeff Neuman:Right....so if the official name is "American National Red Cross", but the "usual name" is "American Red Cross", I think that is fine. Jeff Neuman:Can we change "usual" to "commonly known" Mary Wong:I've tried to capture all this in the chat, Jeff Mary Wong:Notes, I mean, sorry Jeff Neuman:I think there is yes Mary Wong:We will need a specific list to implement - possibly with a clear formula to update, but it can't be open ended. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel staff would need to rely on the info offered by the ICRC, which I presume will be reasonably limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):the burden on the ICRC should be proportionate and reasonable Jeff Neuman:Jorge - I am not saying this is a huge burden. If it is a "usual" name, then how hard would it be to point to examples Jeff Neuman:In other words...for American Red Cross, you just have to say "look at Redcross.org" Jeff Neuman:That's not a burden Jeff Neuman:For British Red Cross, look at "https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.redcross.org.uk_&d=…" Mary Wong:From the staff side, we request that ICANN not be placed in the position of making decisions as to what goes and what does not go on the list. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Thomas: if you invite us for a good coffee, I'll be there ;-) Mary Wong:We will send a Doodle poll if that is beetter Jeff Neuman:Mary - using the examples I provided, I think we can both affirmatively state that ICANN wil not be in tough position Jeff Neuman:But if the Board wants us to revise out policies, staff should be willing to take on additional responsibilities Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):we have to balance trust and burden of proof... Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):thanks all and bye! avri doria:bye

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Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi
by Mary Wong Oct. 19, 2017

Oct. 19, 2017

Dear all, Please be so kind as to fill in this Doodle poll if you will be in Abu Dhabi and would like to attend an informal meeting to continue the discussions: https://icannorg.doodle.com/poll/w4xrnmw79a49u8mm Please note the following: * At this stage, we are not able to secure a room that will have remote participation facilities. It is possible (though not guaranteed) that we can get a room with a telephone, in which case we may be able to offer dial-ins (audio only; there will not be any Adobe Connect functionality, recordings or transcripts). * As such, if you will not be in Abu Dhabi but wish to participate via telephone, feel free to go ahead and indicate your availability – but please put in a comment at the bottom of the poll so that we know you can only participate telephonically. * If we are able to find a slot that works for most members, staff will take notes at the meeting and report back to the full Working Group. As Thomas noted on our last call, this will be an informal meeting and therefore no decisions will be taken. Thanks and cheers Mary From: Mary Wong <mary.wong(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 18:44 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Subject: Action Items & Notes from the call today for the reconvened PDP Working Group on Red Cross names Dear all, Here are the Action Items and Notes from the call that was held earlier today; as Julie has noted (below), the MP3 recording is already available. We will post it and the transcript (when available) to the Working Group wiki space noted in Julie’s message. ACTION ITEMS: * Staff to circulate Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi – as this proposed meeting will be informal, with no remote participation facilities available, no decisions will be made and the proceedings will be reported back to the full WG for further discussion. * Working Group to continue to discuss possible principles for determining what names go on the definitive list to be implemented – based on the initial suggestions from the Red Cross representatives and the notes of the discussion from today (see below). NOTES: * The original PDP recommendation related to the following Red Cross identifiers (termed “Scope 2 Identifiers” in the Working Group’s Final Report): 189 recognized National Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; International Committee of the Red Cross; International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; ICRC, CICR, CICV, MKKK, IFRC, FICR (National Society names protected in English, as well as in their respective national languages; ICRC & IFRC identifiers protected in the 6 United Nations languages). * The scope of this reconvened Working Group does not extend to considering acronyms - we have been tasked to consider the specific Red Cross names at issue. * The contents of the current list of Red Cross identifiers placed under interim reservation by the Board are likely to change once this Working Group’s proposals are accepted. Discussion of Possible Principles for Defining the Final List of Names: * For the International Movement - Full Match of the following, in the six official UN languages: * International Committee of the Red Cross * International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies * POSSIBLE ADDITION (also in UN6): International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement? International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent? * For the National Societies - * What is a "usual name" (as proposed by the Red Cross in Stephane’s most recent email)? This needs to be clarified and understood - is there a formal list? The Council's direction was for a specific and finite set of names, with specified limited variants. * One possibility is to limit the list to "official (full) names" - in their respective national language(s); however, the concept of "usual names" can be refined, e.g. "commonly used". * No objection to including "usual names" as long as the meaning is clearly understood, and there can be a finite list (Note: By "usual" name this is normally the Society name without the word "Society" without the addition of the article "The"). * It may be clearer to use the phrase "official and commonly known names" instead; however, is there a way to ensure that this is specific enough i.e. a definitive list? Can we use something like the TMCH requirement of demonstrating "use"? Alternatively, for "commonly known", can we use the criteria in the additional draft principles suggested by the Red Cross? * Discussion to continue on this topic, and the additional suggested draft principles submitted by the Red Cross representatives. Thanks and cheers Mary From: <gnso-igo-ingo-bounces(a)icann.org> on behalf of Julie Bisland <julie.bisland(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 13:30 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Cc: "gnso-secs(a)icann.org" <gnso-secs(a)icann.org> Subject: [Gnso-igo-ingo] Recordings, Attendance & AC Chat for IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDS PDP WG on Red Cross Names on 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Dear all, Please find the attendance attached, and the mp3, Adobe Connect recording and AC Chat below for the reconvened IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Red Cross Names held on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC. Mp3: https://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-18oct17-en.mp3[audio.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__audio.icann.org_gnso_g…> AC recording: https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/<https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=ba32205baa7d5c6f…> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group…> Mailing list archive: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-igo-ingo/ Agenda Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/ApJEB[community.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_…> ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Thank you. Kind regards, Julie ——————————————— Adobe Connect chat transcript for 18 October 2017 Julie Bisland:Welcome to the Reconvened IGO INGO PDP Working Group on Red Cross names call on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Julie Bisland:Agenda wiki page: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_… Thomas Rickert:HI alll, one moment , please! Osvaldo Novoa:hello all, I am in Brazil in a hotel with a very slow WiFi, so my access is somewhat limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):sorry - coming in late Mary Wong:No worries, Thomas - we're a team! Mary Wong:Here is the link from Berry's email: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_sites_de… Mary Wong:And note that these Red Cross names are reserved on an interim basis until the issue is resolved, which is what our reconvened WG has been tasked to try to do. Jeff Neuman:Just to confirm - the list at that link - is that the list of currently protected names, or the list they want protected Mary Wong:Current Julie Bisland:Stephane, you should be able to speak into phone, as it is unmuted Julie Bisland:maybe move on while the operator troubleshoots his line Mary Wong:@Jeff, it is possible that the final list will look somewhat different from what is at the current link. Hankins:Sorry for this please go ahead... Berry Cobb:@Jeff, the link is what is currently protected. The attached word doc was a list at a first attempt to reconcile the names. Berry Cobb:@Jeff, those acronyms and out of scope for this reconvened group. Berry Cobb:"are" not and Berry Cobb:Apologies to the WG. I have contractors directly behind me with too much noise to contribute via audio. Mary Wong:@Jeff, the list is currently what is (temporarily) reserved - that is why they are in the document marked up by Stephane and his team. Jeff Neuman:But acronymns are on both lists Jeff Neuman:both the list from Berry as well as the one from Stephane Mary Wong:At the moment, yes - b/c they were reserved per Board direction on an interim basis. Mary Wong:We only have that one list at the moment - we don't yet have a list FROM this group since we haven't agreed on the formula and criteria. Jeff Neuman:Under the GNSO policy that we passed, what is the list of names that would be protected. That is what I would like to see Jeff Neuman:not the ones that are currently protected by the Board Jeff Neuman:or the ones proposed Mary Wong:@Jeff - we don't have a full list of those, with their DNS labels and language variants - since those were NOT adopted by the Board (hence our work here in this group), and so have NOT moved into implementation. Jeff Neuman:Thanks Mary, I have my hand raised Jeff Neuman:to discuss Mary Wong:You're welcome! So, basically all we have as an implementable list (which is what is on screen here) is the list of a few RC identifiers that were approved under the original PDP (Page 1), and the rest of the list is the TEMPORARY reserved list (which is why acronyms are included, but which is NOT expected to be the final list coming out of our work). Hopefully that helps. Julie Bisland:reminder: please mute Mary Wong:Stephane also had a number of comments and specific questions in his email that we have not extracted for this document, but we have them ready for discussion if needed. Berry Cobb:I'd just like to point out that the use of "hypens" is a part of that algrorithm when we convert the formal names. So that is automatic in that regard. Mary Wong:I believe Stephane is referring to this part of his email: "Names already included by the Board in the list of reserved names such as “magen david adom”, “red star of david”, but also “international red cross and red crescent movement” in the 6 UN languages (that is the Statutory name endorsed by the States), etc. " Mary Wong:Done, Thomas Jeff Neuman:So, adding the word "movement" to all of them? Jeff Neuman:So long as we are just talking in terms of full names and not abbreviations, I guess no issues Hankins:Mary - I am referring to the name "International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent", that is the statutory name of the Movement / endorsed by States Jeff Neuman:internationalredandcrossredcrescentmovement (Is that more than 63 characters?) Berry Cobb:63 Char issues will be an output of the algorithm. This discussion is about which formal designations will be reservered. Berry Cobb:Should they be >63, they will not be added to any future reserved list Jeff Neuman:internationalmovementoftheredcrossandredcrescent.TLD Jeff Neuman:I hear you Berry....I just like to visualize Jeff Neuman:Lets just make sure we are really precise in the principle Berry Cobb:Time check - 15 minutes. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):We need to protect usual names - although this is a criterion it would take form of a finite number of names pursuant to the list produced by the ICRC Mason Cole:Thomas, should it be defined as the official "full" name for avoidance of doubt? Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry, I have to leave now. I will read the transcript. Best regards. Thomas Rickert:bye Osvaldo Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Jeff: I will leave that to Stephane -but we should avoid a chicken and egg problem as in the end the criterion will be complemented with a finite list the way I understand this effort Jeff Neuman:Right....so if the official name is "American National Red Cross", but the "usual name" is "American Red Cross", I think that is fine. Jeff Neuman:Can we change "usual" to "commonly known" Mary Wong:I've tried to capture all this in the chat, Jeff Mary Wong:Notes, I mean, sorry Jeff Neuman:I think there is yes Mary Wong:We will need a specific list to implement - possibly with a clear formula to update, but it can't be open ended. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel staff would need to rely on the info offered by the ICRC, which I presume will be reasonably limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):the burden on the ICRC should be proportionate and reasonable Jeff Neuman:Jorge - I am not saying this is a huge burden. If it is a "usual" name, then how hard would it be to point to examples Jeff Neuman:In other words...for American Red Cross, you just have to say "look at Redcross.org" Jeff Neuman:That's not a burden Jeff Neuman:For British Red Cross, look at "https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.redcross.org.uk_&d=…" Mary Wong:From the staff side, we request that ICANN not be placed in the position of making decisions as to what goes and what does not go on the list. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Thomas: if you invite us for a good coffee, I'll be there ;-) Mary Wong:We will send a Doodle poll if that is beetter Jeff Neuman:Mary - using the examples I provided, I think we can both affirmatively state that ICANN wil not be in tough position Jeff Neuman:But if the Board wants us to revise out policies, staff should be willing to take on additional responsibilities Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):we have to balance trust and burden of proof... Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):thanks all and bye! avri doria:bye

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Action Items & Notes from the call today for the reconvened PDP Working Group on Red Cross names
by Mary Wong Oct. 18, 2017

Oct. 18, 2017

Dear all, Here are the Action Items and Notes from the call that was held earlier today; as Julie has noted (below), the MP3 recording is already available. We will post it and the transcript (when available) to the Working Group wiki space noted in Julie’s message. ACTION ITEMS: * Staff to circulate Doodle poll for informal meeting in Abu Dhabi – as this proposed meeting will be informal, with no remote participation facilities available, no decisions will be made and the proceedings will be reported back to the full WG for further discussion. * Working Group to continue to discuss possible principles for determining what names go on the definitive list to be implemented – based on the initial suggestions from the Red Cross representatives and the notes of the discussion from today (see below). NOTES: * The original PDP recommendation related to the following Red Cross identifiers (termed “Scope 2 Identifiers” in the Working Group’s Final Report): 189 recognized National Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; International Committee of the Red Cross; International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies; ICRC, CICR, CICV, MKKK, IFRC, FICR (National Society names protected in English, as well as in their respective national languages; ICRC & IFRC identifiers protected in the 6 United Nations languages). * The scope of this reconvened Working Group does not extend to considering acronyms - we have been tasked to consider the specific Red Cross names at issue. * The contents of the current list of Red Cross identifiers placed under interim reservation by the Board are likely to change once this Working Group’s proposals are accepted. Discussion of Possible Principles for Defining the Final List of Names: * For the International Movement - Full Match of the following, in the six official UN languages: * International Committee of the Red Cross * International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies * POSSIBLE ADDITION (also in UN6): International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement? International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent? * For the National Societies - * What is a "usual name" (as proposed by the Red Cross in Stephane’s most recent email)? This needs to be clarified and understood - is there a formal list? The Council's direction was for a specific and finite set of names, with specified limited variants. * One possibility is to limit the list to "official (full) names" - in their respective national language(s); however, the concept of "usual names" can be refined, e.g. "commonly used". * No objection to including "usual names" as long as the meaning is clearly understood, and there can be a finite list (Note: By "usual" name this is normally the Society name without the word "Society" without the addition of the article "The"). * It may be clearer to use the phrase "official and commonly known names" instead; however, is there a way to ensure that this is specific enough i.e. a definitive list? Can we use something like the TMCH requirement of demonstrating "use"? Alternatively, for "commonly known", can we use the criteria in the additional draft principles suggested by the Red Cross? * Discussion to continue on this topic, and the additional suggested draft principles submitted by the Red Cross representatives. Thanks and cheers Mary From: <gnso-igo-ingo-bounces(a)icann.org> on behalf of Julie Bisland <julie.bisland(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 13:30 To: "gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org" <gnso-igo-ingo(a)icann.org> Cc: "gnso-secs(a)icann.org" <gnso-secs(a)icann.org> Subject: [Gnso-igo-ingo] Recordings, Attendance & AC Chat for IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDS PDP WG on Red Cross Names on 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Dear all, Please find the attendance attached, and the mp3, Adobe Connect recording and AC Chat below for the reconvened IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Red Cross Names held on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC. Mp3: https://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-18oct17-en.mp3[audio.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__audio.icann.org_gnso_g…> AC recording: https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/<https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=ba32205baa7d5c6f…> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group…> Mailing list archive: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-igo-ingo/ Agenda Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/ApJEB[community.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_…> ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Thank you. Kind regards, Julie ——————————————— Adobe Connect chat transcript for 18 October 2017 Julie Bisland:Welcome to the Reconvened IGO INGO PDP Working Group on Red Cross names call on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Julie Bisland:Agenda wiki page: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_… Thomas Rickert:HI alll, one moment , please! Osvaldo Novoa:hello all, I am in Brazil in a hotel with a very slow WiFi, so my access is somewhat limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):sorry - coming in late Mary Wong:No worries, Thomas - we're a team! Mary Wong:Here is the link from Berry's email: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_sites_de… Mary Wong:And note that these Red Cross names are reserved on an interim basis until the issue is resolved, which is what our reconvened WG has been tasked to try to do. Jeff Neuman:Just to confirm - the list at that link - is that the list of currently protected names, or the list they want protected Mary Wong:Current Julie Bisland:Stephane, you should be able to speak into phone, as it is unmuted Julie Bisland:maybe move on while the operator troubleshoots his line Mary Wong:@Jeff, it is possible that the final list will look somewhat different from what is at the current link. Hankins:Sorry for this please go ahead... Berry Cobb:@Jeff, the link is what is currently protected. The attached word doc was a list at a first attempt to reconcile the names. Berry Cobb:@Jeff, those acronyms and out of scope for this reconvened group. Berry Cobb:"are" not and Berry Cobb:Apologies to the WG. I have contractors directly behind me with too much noise to contribute via audio. Mary Wong:@Jeff, the list is currently what is (temporarily) reserved - that is why they are in the document marked up by Stephane and his team. Jeff Neuman:But acronymns are on both lists Jeff Neuman:both the list from Berry as well as the one from Stephane Mary Wong:At the moment, yes - b/c they were reserved per Board direction on an interim basis. Mary Wong:We only have that one list at the moment - we don't yet have a list FROM this group since we haven't agreed on the formula and criteria. Jeff Neuman:Under the GNSO policy that we passed, what is the list of names that would be protected. That is what I would like to see Jeff Neuman:not the ones that are currently protected by the Board Jeff Neuman:or the ones proposed Mary Wong:@Jeff - we don't have a full list of those, with their DNS labels and language variants - since those were NOT adopted by the Board (hence our work here in this group), and so have NOT moved into implementation. Jeff Neuman:Thanks Mary, I have my hand raised Jeff Neuman:to discuss Mary Wong:You're welcome! So, basically all we have as an implementable list (which is what is on screen here) is the list of a few RC identifiers that were approved under the original PDP (Page 1), and the rest of the list is the TEMPORARY reserved list (which is why acronyms are included, but which is NOT expected to be the final list coming out of our work). Hopefully that helps. Julie Bisland:reminder: please mute Mary Wong:Stephane also had a number of comments and specific questions in his email that we have not extracted for this document, but we have them ready for discussion if needed. Berry Cobb:I'd just like to point out that the use of "hypens" is a part of that algrorithm when we convert the formal names. So that is automatic in that regard. Mary Wong:I believe Stephane is referring to this part of his email: "Names already included by the Board in the list of reserved names such as “magen david adom”, “red star of david”, but also “international red cross and red crescent movement” in the 6 UN languages (that is the Statutory name endorsed by the States), etc. " Mary Wong:Done, Thomas Jeff Neuman:So, adding the word "movement" to all of them? Jeff Neuman:So long as we are just talking in terms of full names and not abbreviations, I guess no issues Hankins:Mary - I am referring to the name "International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent", that is the statutory name of the Movement / endorsed by States Jeff Neuman:internationalredandcrossredcrescentmovement (Is that more than 63 characters?) Berry Cobb:63 Char issues will be an output of the algorithm. This discussion is about which formal designations will be reservered. Berry Cobb:Should they be >63, they will not be added to any future reserved list Jeff Neuman:internationalmovementoftheredcrossandredcrescent.TLD Jeff Neuman:I hear you Berry....I just like to visualize Jeff Neuman:Lets just make sure we are really precise in the principle Berry Cobb:Time check - 15 minutes. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):We need to protect usual names - although this is a criterion it would take form of a finite number of names pursuant to the list produced by the ICRC Mason Cole:Thomas, should it be defined as the official "full" name for avoidance of doubt? Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry, I have to leave now. I will read the transcript. Best regards. Thomas Rickert:bye Osvaldo Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Jeff: I will leave that to Stephane -but we should avoid a chicken and egg problem as in the end the criterion will be complemented with a finite list the way I understand this effort Jeff Neuman:Right....so if the official name is "American National Red Cross", but the "usual name" is "American Red Cross", I think that is fine. Jeff Neuman:Can we change "usual" to "commonly known" Mary Wong:I've tried to capture all this in the chat, Jeff Mary Wong:Notes, I mean, sorry Jeff Neuman:I think there is yes Mary Wong:We will need a specific list to implement - possibly with a clear formula to update, but it can't be open ended. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel staff would need to rely on the info offered by the ICRC, which I presume will be reasonably limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):the burden on the ICRC should be proportionate and reasonable Jeff Neuman:Jorge - I am not saying this is a huge burden. If it is a "usual" name, then how hard would it be to point to examples Jeff Neuman:In other words...for American Red Cross, you just have to say "look at Redcross.org" Jeff Neuman:That's not a burden Jeff Neuman:For British Red Cross, look at "https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.redcross.org.uk_&d=…" Mary Wong:From the staff side, we request that ICANN not be placed in the position of making decisions as to what goes and what does not go on the list. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Thomas: if you invite us for a good coffee, I'll be there ;-) Mary Wong:We will send a Doodle poll if that is beetter Jeff Neuman:Mary - using the examples I provided, I think we can both affirmatively state that ICANN wil not be in tough position Jeff Neuman:But if the Board wants us to revise out policies, staff should be willing to take on additional responsibilities Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):we have to balance trust and burden of proof... Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):thanks all and bye! avri doria:bye

1 0

Recordings, Attendance & AC Chat for IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDS PDP WG on Red Cross Names on 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC
by Julie Bisland Oct. 18, 2017

Oct. 18, 2017

Dear all, Please find the attendance attached, and the mp3, Adobe Connect recording and AC Chat below for the reconvened IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Red Cross Names held on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC. Mp3: https://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-18oct17-en.mp3 AC recording: https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/<https://participate.icann.org/p2ds5sxzy14/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=ba32205baa7d5c6f…> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group…> Mailing list archive: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-igo-ingo/ Agenda Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/ApJEB ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Thank you. Kind regards, Julie --------------- Adobe Connect chat transcript for 18 October 2017 Julie Bisland:Welcome to the Reconvened IGO INGO PDP Working Group on Red Cross names call on Wednesday, 18 October 2017 at 13:00 UTC Julie Bisland:Agenda wiki page: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_… Thomas Rickert:HI alll, one moment , please! Osvaldo Novoa:hello all, I am in Brazil in a hotel with a very slow WiFi, so my access is somewhat limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):sorry - coming in late Mary Wong:No worries, Thomas - we're a team! Mary Wong:Here is the link from Berry's email: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_sites_de… Mary Wong:And note that these Red Cross names are reserved on an interim basis until the issue is resolved, which is what our reconvened WG has been tasked to try to do. Jeff Neuman:Just to confirm - the list at that link - is that the list of currently protected names, or the list they want protected Mary Wong:Current Julie Bisland:Stephane, you should be able to speak into phone, as it is unmuted Julie Bisland:maybe move on while the operator troubleshoots his line Mary Wong:@Jeff, it is possible that the final list will look somewhat different from what is at the current link. Hankins:Sorry for this please go ahead... Berry Cobb:@Jeff, the link is what is currently protected. The attached word doc was a list at a first attempt to reconcile the names. Berry Cobb:@Jeff, those acronyms and out of scope for this reconvened group. Berry Cobb:"are" not and Berry Cobb:Apologies to the WG. I have contractors directly behind me with too much noise to contribute via audio. Mary Wong:@Jeff, the list is currently what is (temporarily) reserved - that is why they are in the document marked up by Stephane and his team. Jeff Neuman:But acronymns are on both lists Jeff Neuman:both the list from Berry as well as the one from Stephane Mary Wong:At the moment, yes - b/c they were reserved per Board direction on an interim basis. Mary Wong:We only have that one list at the moment - we don't yet have a list FROM this group since we haven't agreed on the formula and criteria. Jeff Neuman:Under the GNSO policy that we passed, what is the list of names that would be protected. That is what I would like to see Jeff Neuman:not the ones that are currently protected by the Board Jeff Neuman:or the ones proposed Mary Wong:@Jeff - we don't have a full list of those, with their DNS labels and language variants - since those were NOT adopted by the Board (hence our work here in this group), and so have NOT moved into implementation. Jeff Neuman:Thanks Mary, I have my hand raised Jeff Neuman:to discuss Mary Wong:You're welcome! So, basically all we have as an implementable list (which is what is on screen here) is the list of a few RC identifiers that were approved under the original PDP (Page 1), and the rest of the list is the TEMPORARY reserved list (which is why acronyms are included, but which is NOT expected to be the final list coming out of our work). Hopefully that helps. Julie Bisland:reminder: please mute Mary Wong:Stephane also had a number of comments and specific questions in his email that we have not extracted for this document, but we have them ready for discussion if needed. Berry Cobb:I'd just like to point out that the use of "hypens" is a part of that algrorithm when we convert the formal names. So that is automatic in that regard. Mary Wong:I believe Stephane is referring to this part of his email: "Names already included by the Board in the list of reserved names such as "magen david adom", "red star of david", but also "international red cross and red crescent movement" in the 6 UN languages (that is the Statutory name endorsed by the States), etc. " Mary Wong:Done, Thomas Jeff Neuman:So, adding the word "movement" to all of them? Jeff Neuman:So long as we are just talking in terms of full names and not abbreviations, I guess no issues Hankins:Mary - I am referring to the name "International Movement of the Red Cross and Red Crescent", that is the statutory name of the Movement / endorsed by States Jeff Neuman:internationalredandcrossredcrescentmovement (Is that more than 63 characters?) Berry Cobb:63 Char issues will be an output of the algorithm. This discussion is about which formal designations will be reservered. Berry Cobb:Should they be >63, they will not be added to any future reserved list Jeff Neuman:internationalmovementoftheredcrossandredcrescent.TLD Jeff Neuman:I hear you Berry....I just like to visualize Jeff Neuman:Lets just make sure we are really precise in the principle Berry Cobb:Time check - 15 minutes. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):We need to protect usual names - although this is a criterion it would take form of a finite number of names pursuant to the list produced by the ICRC Mason Cole:Thomas, should it be defined as the official "full" name for avoidance of doubt? Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry, I have to leave now. I will read the transcript. Best regards. Thomas Rickert:bye Osvaldo Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Jeff: I will leave that to Stephane -but we should avoid a chicken and egg problem as in the end the criterion will be complemented with a finite list the way I understand this effort Jeff Neuman:Right....so if the official name is "American National Red Cross", but the "usual name" is "American Red Cross", I think that is fine. Jeff Neuman:Can we change "usual" to "commonly known" Mary Wong:I've tried to capture all this in the chat, Jeff Mary Wong:Notes, I mean, sorry Jeff Neuman:I think there is yes Mary Wong:We will need a specific list to implement - possibly with a clear formula to update, but it can't be open ended. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel staff would need to rely on the info offered by the ICRC, which I presume will be reasonably limited Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):the burden on the ICRC should be proportionate and reasonable Jeff Neuman:Jorge - I am not saying this is a huge burden. If it is a "usual" name, then how hard would it be to point to examples Jeff Neuman:In other words...for American Red Cross, you just have to say "look at Redcross.org" Jeff Neuman:That's not a burden Jeff Neuman:For British Red Cross, look at "https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.redcross.org.uk_&d=…" Mary Wong:From the staff side, we request that ICANN not be placed in the position of making decisions as to what goes and what does not go on the list. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Thomas: if you invite us for a good coffee, I'll be there ;-) Mary Wong:We will send a Doodle poll if that is beetter Jeff Neuman:Mary - using the examples I provided, I think we can both affirmatively state that ICANN wil not be in tough position Jeff Neuman:But if the Board wants us to revise out policies, staff should be willing to take on additional responsibilities Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):we have to balance trust and burden of proof... Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):thanks all and bye! avri doria:bye

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Agenda - Reconvened IGO-INGO Protections PDP Working Group (Red Cross) - 18 October 2017 @ 13:00 UTC
by Berry Cobb Oct. 18, 2017

Oct. 18, 2017

Dear all, Please find below the proposed agenda for the next Working Group call (scheduled for Wednesday 18 October at 13:00 UTC). As a part of the agenda review, please also review the attached document from Thomas that expands on planned discussions about the next steps for protections of ICRC identifiers. Agenda: (0) Roll call, Agenda bash and SOI Updates (1) Review Original PDP WG recommendation on scope of Red Cross Society identifiers to receive protection and history for how they are currently reserved (2) Review red-line list of DNS labels as provided by the advisors of the ICRC (3) Discuss possible formula to determine which identifiers will receive protection and formulate principles to define the policy (4) ICANN 60 Preparations Thank you B Berry A. Cobb 720.839.5735 mail(a)berrycobb.com @berrycobb

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ICANN60: GNSO Sessions How to Get Organized and Remote Participation Details
by Nathalie Peregrine Oct. 17, 2017

Oct. 17, 2017

Dear all, The one-stop wiki page for all your Remote Participation queries is now available. This wiki page covers remote participation details for all GNSO open and public meetings. In addition to this, ICANN meetings’ team has put together a new ICANN meeting website which allows you to download all GNSO-related meetings to your inbox calendar in one go. 2 LINKS TO BOOKMARK NOW: ICANN60 Meeting Schedule[schedule.icann.org]<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__schedule.icann.org_&d=…> GNSO Remote Participation wiki page<https://community.icann.org/x/7ichB> Step 1 – Create a profile and your personalized ICANN60 schedule Go to the Meeting Schedule webpage, and if not done yet for previous meetings, create a profile and login. Every session on the schedule can be selected and added to your individual schedule. By clicking to the left of each meeting, this adds it to your individual schedule which you can then email to yourself or add to your calendar. See next step. Step 2 At the top right-hand corner of the page click on the ‘Mobile App + ical” icon to download the mobile app and choose from various options how to sync your personalized schedule to your phone or laptop calendars. Step 3 All Adobe Connect rooms (which can be found on the session information on the Meeting Schedule and on the GNSO Remote Participation wiki page) will provide audio streaming. If you cannot join an Adobe Connect room for a session, and will need to dial in with your phone, please refer to the GNSO Remote Participation wiki page for the audio pass codes and dial in numbers. Please also follow the previous steps if you wish to take part in the session over the phone. Nathalie Peregrine and Terri Agnew will be onsite to assist you directly. For all GNSO meeting related queries (RP or others), please email us at: gnso-secs(a)icann.org<applewebdata://FB60497E-61D8-4FE9-BF9C-EB238191E416/gnso-secs@icann.org> and we will be more than happy to assist! Kind regards, GNSO SO/AC Support team Nathalie Peregrine Manager, Operations Support (GNSO) Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) Email: nathalie.peregrine(a)icann.org <nathalie.peregrine(a)icann.org%20> Skype: nathalie.peregrine.icann Find out more about the GNSO by taking our interactive courses<applewebdata://EB3A6F47-9760-400D-A39B-A7EFFC56B467/learn.icann.org/courses…> and visiting the GNSO Newcomer pages<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_sites_gn…>

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Recordings, Attendance & AC Chat for IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDS PDP WG on Red Cross Names on 7 September 2017 at 14:00 UTC
by Nathalie Peregrine Sept. 7, 2017

Sept. 7, 2017

Dear all, Please find the attendance attached, and the mp3, Adobe Connect recording and AC Chat below for the reconvened IGO-INGO Protections in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Red Cross Names held on Thursday, 7 September 2017 at 14:00 UTC. Mp3: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-07sep17-en.mp3 AC recording: https://participate.icann.org/p4s9tsrbo86/<https://participate.icann.org/p4s9tsrbo86/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=896f95e112d5b2ad…> The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page: http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group…> Mailing list archive: http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-igo-ingo/ Agenda Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/rhghB ** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list ** Thank you. Kind regards, Nathalie ——————————————— Adobe Connect chat transcript for 7 September 2017 Nathalie Peregrine:Dear all, welcome to the IGO INGO PDP Working Group on Red Cross names on Thursday, 7 September 2017 at 14:00 UTC Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):Hi all! Ken Stubbs - Afilias:hurricane hitting st.maarten yesterday https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.mahobeachcam.com_&d… Nathalie Peregrine:Stephane Hankins has joined the audio bridge Mary Wong:We can put up the language from the Convention on the screen, if that is helpful. Mary Wong:The relevant Articles that the Red Cross representatives also spoke to on the last call, and followed up on email, is on Page 3. Greg Shatan:Very good point Heather about what needs to go to Council. Council is not a rubber stamp either. But it needs a succinct briefing that allows Council to exercise their judgment. Heather Forrest:I anticipate that if Council does not receive a comprehensible rationale for this group's recommendations, it will send the recommendations back with a request for more information. Let's prevent that from happening. Ken Stubbs - Afilias:cant we use the agree button Mary Wong:Here is the list of Red Cross National Society names currently under interim reservation: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_sites_de… Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):Thanks, Mary! Heather Forrest:Indeed this list must be finite and every possible punctuation/misspelling variation cannot possibly be captured Heather Forrest:I note that "spr" and "frk" are on the list - these are acronyms (I presume) and thus cannot be part of our consideration Mary Wong:The AC screen shows you a snapshot of the list - to illustrate Thomas' point about the various forms of each National Society name. Greg Shatan:How many strings are on this list? Greg Shatan:I see mkkk as another acronym. Mary Wong:Note that acronyms are NOT part of the scope of the work of this group - we have been tasked to only consider the names. Greg Shatan:We need a list without the acronyms, then. Mary Wong:The list includes acronyms for now because the Board resolution included acronyms as part of the INTERIM reservation. Mary Wong:@Greg, yes Heather Forrest:+1 Greg. As per Mary's comment, acronyms are not within our scope Mary Wong:There is no request for reservation of Red Cross acronyms on the table - and the GAC did not ask for this either (for RC acronyms). Greg Shatan:I don't see CIRC on the list. Am I missing something? Heather Forrest:We need clarification for the non-ASCII scripts to ensure these are not acronyms Greg Shatan:How did the temporary block pick the acronyms out of this list? Greg Shatan:i.e., only to apply the names. Greg Shatan:If acronyms are off the table, they need to be. out of the table as well. Mary Wong:The acronyms remain an outstanding issue to be resolved separately from this Working Group's scope. Mary Wong:The Scope 2 language Berry is mentioning has been pasted into the Notes pod on the right Heather Forrest:Given that this list on the screen was developed by staff, can we have access to the original list as provided by ICRC? Greg Shatan:Barbados is an English language country.... Chuck Gomes:Can we have scroll control? Mary Wong:@Heather, @Greg, we will try to locate the list from the Red Cross. Please give us a moment. Nathalie Peregrine:@Chuck, enabled. Chuck Gomes:Thanks Heather Forrest:No rush, Mary, and thanks Chuck Gomes:I suggest that we don't spend time debating variations that are non-controversial such as with or without the article 'the'. Mary Wong:The GAC request in relation to language: "in English and the official languages of their respective states of origin". Heather Forrest:Picking up on Stephane's point just now, I believe that whatever criteria we establish, we should apply them consistently throughout the entire list Thomas Rickert:general formular for the composition of blocked strings: 1. names of the society- official version- version the societies are known by2. With and without hyphen3. Inclusion of the article4. Inclusion or not of the word „society“ Thomas Rickert:official language(s) of the country of origin of the society + EN Chuck Gomes:In some cases there be more than one offical language. Chuck Gomes:So the (s) is important in 'language(s)'. Ken Stubbs - Afilias:cannot agree with acronym request ! Chuck Gomes:We are not considering acronyms. Chuck Gomes:I like Thomas's suggested criteria. Greg Shatan:Does this mean that each national society generates at least 8 strings, assuming English language only? Ken Stubbs - Afilias:+1 chuck.. no mention of acronyms in our documents other than acronyms were not considered as they were out of scope for our group Greg Shatan:And 8 for each other language, assuming use of articles? Berry Cobb:Here is the orginal list that was used later to help build what is in Spec 5 today. https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_issu… Heather Forrest:Helpful, Berry, thank you Greg Shatan:I think it's important to understand that when we throw around the number 190, that is not anywhere close to the number of blocked strings.... Greg Shatan:@Chuck, I think that's what RPMs are for. Berry Cobb:It is also complicated in that some society names submitted exceed 63 charachters when converted to DNS Labels. Also a few of the society names that were in this list were only images, and staff could not generate a DNS label from it. Lastly, society names submitted in not latin charachter, were converted to IDN u-labels Berry Cobb:sorry IDN a-labels Stephane Hankins:Mary - to be added variations of names with or without the word "Society". Heather Forrest:+1 Greg - what we are considering here is not the only avenue of protection available Mary Wong:@Stephane, thank you - I've updated the notes Greg Shatan:UDRP should be available in many of those cases, Chuck. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel that as long as we have a defined list of protected names with a finite list of variations we should go this way... Mary Wong:All, here is the pertinent part of the GNSO Council's request, regarding the scope of names: "an exact match of the full name of the relevant National Society recognized within the International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement (in English and the official languages of its state of origin), the full names of the International Committee of the Red Cross and of the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies (in the six official United Nations languages) and a defined limited set of variations of these names". Chuck Gomes:Thanks Thomas. Greg Shatan:"Variations" should be dealt with in the curative rights arena (and PDP). Heather Forrest:again this precise point is not within our scope. There is an existing PDP on this topic Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):The GNSO Resolution is clear that we have as our task to also look ar a defined limited set of variations of these names Mary Wong:@Jorge, yes, exactly. Which means that any variant that is NOT on the defined limited set of names will need to be dealt with by curative rights processes. Greg Shatan:The defined limited set of variations is covered by the presence or not of "the" and "society". Variations are not "imitations." Greg Shatan:We will need to see the real list of strings in advance and not the mish-mash that is on the Spec 5 list. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):@Thomas/staff: please circulate this plan (you are just explaining) in writing - it would help to keep up :-) Mary Wong:@Jorge, we will do that. Heather Forrest:Excellent progress and leadership, Thomas. Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):+1 Heather Greg Shatan:Sounds like a plan, Thomas. Heather Forrest:No objections, it's 1am here Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I'm sure ICANN staff can help very much in developing the list :-) Greg Shatan:I thought we had 3 years.... Mary Wong:If we may, staff would like to note for the record that Stephane and his colleagues have, as he has mentioned, kindly offered previously to work with us to develop a clean, more updated list. Mary Wong:From the ICANN side, we can only work with the lists that we have been provided with. Greg Shatan:From the WG side as well, Mary! Heather Forrest:Thanks Thomas Greg Shatan:Thank you, Thomas and all! Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):thanks Thomas and all, bye!

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Re: [Gnso-igo-ingo] Agenda - Reconvened IGO-INGO Protections PDP Working Group (Red Cross) - 7 September 2017 @ 14:00 UTC
by Berry Cobb Sept. 6, 2017

Sept. 6, 2017

Dear all, Please find below the proposed agenda for the next Working Group call (scheduled for Thursday 7 September at 14:00 UTC). Agenda: (0) Roll call, Agenda bash and SOI Updates (1) Discussion of additional questions on the legal basis, if any (2) Consensus call on legal basis (if possible) (3) Review scope of protections (list of labels currently reserved as placed on Specification 5) https://www.icann.org/sites/default/files/packages/reserved-names/ReservedNa mes.xml#red-cross-international (4) Next scheduled meeting Thank you. B Berry A. Cobb Internet Corporation for Assigned Names & Numbers 720.839.5735 mail(a)berrycobb.com @berrycobb

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