September 2018 - Latingp - lists.icann.org

IP feedback on Google docs
by Mirjana Tasić Sept. 29, 2018

Sept. 29, 2018

Dear GP members, Please find documents form IP uploaded to Google docs IP-Review-Latin-Variants-IP https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WtUcHnlIMJ9qvH4HJ3_nAqH8E2wVp74H-fX1l0q… Comments-Latin-Variants-IP https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Zfa0KjLlNyAgteu1Yt1eqiUOGf3acdAl_3w67TJ… IP-response-Latin-LGR-20180910-2 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rjbJEYtvhGk8WHpQmZHYHDH9twEP_4KhWaINoFJ… Regards Mirjana

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Latin LGR proposal 20180910 - IP Response
by Sarmad Hussain Sept. 28, 2018

Sept. 28, 2018

Dear Latin GP members, Please find the responses from the IP to the documents (and proposal) shared by the Latin GP. Regards, Sarmad

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Brussels meeting Oct 1-3
by Mats Dufberg Sept. 27, 2018

Sept. 27, 2018

I have not seen a list a participants at the Brussels meeting. I will arrive late Sunday and leave Wednesday night. And I will stay at the Aloft Hotel. Mats --- Mats Dufberg DNS Specialist, IIS Mobile: +46 73 065 3899 https://www.iis.se/en/

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Summary of Latin GP Meeting on 6 and 20 September 2018
by Pitinan Kooarmornpatana Sept. 25, 2018

Sept. 25, 2018

Dear Latin GP members, Please find attached the summary of the meeting of the Latin GP Meeting on 6 and 20 September 2018. Please let us know if you would like to suggest any edits or additions. Action Items from 20 September 2018 S. No. Action Items Owner 1 Finalize the letter to IP in response to the ““Diacritics below a security risk?” and share with the GP before submitting to the IP. MT 2 Review and provide feedback for the Brussels F2F meeting agenda. ALL Action Items from 6 September 2018 S. No. Action Items Owner 1 Finalize the new version of the LGR Proposal and submit to the IP by 10 September 2018 MT 2 Draft the letter to the Armenian GP DT Strikethrough = done This summary and the recording will be posted at the Latin GP wiki page shortly at https://community.icann.org/display/croscomlgrprocedure/Latin+GP Regards, Pitinan

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For IP:.Re: From IP: Diacritics below a security risk?
by Mirjana Tasić Sept. 21, 2018

Sept. 21, 2018

Dear IP, Please find enclosed the response of Latin GP to your letter “Diacritics below a security risk?”. Latin GP cannot give the direct answer to your letter in this turn. Latin GP will appreciate very much if you could help us to clarify the questions we are discussing in our document sent as attachment in this message. We shall have face to face meeting in Brussels from October the 1st for three days. Your response to this document could help us to be more efficient and finalize our work. It would also help us to provide a better response to your question about diacritics. Best regards Mirjana Tasic From: Latin GP <latingp-bounces(a)icann.org> on behalf of Sarmad Hussain <sarmad.hussain(a)icann.org> Date: Wednesday, August 29, 2018 at 08:58 To: Latin GP <latingp(a)icann.org> Subject: [Latingp] From IP: Diacritics below a security risk? Dear Latin GP members Kindly find below some feedback from IP for your consideration. Regards Sarmad TO: LatinGP FROM: IP There are recent and widely published examples of phishing attacks using Latin IDNs in which the key features involved were diacritics below the letter. Here is an example: [cid:part1.E6E9F88C.32B00687@ix.netcom.com] Of all diacritics, diacritics below can be difficult to distinguish or be prone to clipping -- there is less space below the baseline than between the typical lowercase glyph and the top of the line. The example given above shows a further interaction with URL underlining - and not all display engines actually do as nice a job interrupting the underline as in the screen shot above. For example, here is how one system will render this (using a designated UI font - Segoe UI): [cid:part2.59964F92.16B1BC0B@ix.netcom.com] Note, this code point (U+1E33) is in the MSR as is (U+1E35 LATIN SMALL K WITH LINE BELOW). [cid:part3.99B9649E.C3C335FC@ix.netcom.com] The second example contains U+1E35 -- while the effect does not show equally at all type sizes, from 12pt and below the LINE BELOW is reliably hidden. Here are the two examples at 10pt [cid:part4.B43CE3FD.8C84EACF@ix.netcom.com] The issue is not limited to "K". We see "B", "D", "L" and "N" with both DOT and LINE BELOW and "M" and "H" with DOT BELOW, all on the same page in the MSR. It can be argued users have no working understanding of typography and would not reliably interpret small gaps or bulges in the underline as being related to an unfamiliar code point. This appears to make all diacritics below security-sensitive, however, the initial determination belongs to the relevant GPs. Note by the way that the Devanagari LGR treats sequences containing NUKTA (a dot below) as variants in at least some cases and recent community comments for that script are calling for more variant sequences. However, while the feature is graphically analog (dot below), each script works differently and there is no single a-priori solution. The IP would like to encourage the LatinGP (and any other GP facing cases like this) to explicitly examine this example and other cases like it, where code points can become indistinguishable in common usage scenarios for IDNs, and formally conclude whether and how to take these into account when designing their LGR. At this point, the IP would expect the GP to: * explicitly discuss this and other scenarios like it * evaluate whether they constitute a security risk to the Root Zone * come up with a reasoned decision as to whether and how to address them in the design of the Latin GP; and finally * document both the decision and its rationale. In coming to a decision, the GP may resolve: 1) to make them variants 2) to list them for attention as confusable 3) to take no action, because the GP feels that they do not represent a special security risk. As part of the review of the Latin LGR, the IP will look at the background and rationale offered by the Latin GP in coming to its conclusion; note that if the IP feels that the facts considered and rationale documented do not support the conclusion reached by the GP it may raise objections at that time.

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I have sent the version of Response before Meikal and Mats corrections
by Mirjana Tasić Sept. 20, 2018

Sept. 20, 2018

Dear GP members, I did not check the google doc version of the response, I used word version which I had on my computer. So, the corrections done by Mats and Meikal are not included in the version I sent. Sorry for this. Regards Mirjana

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Concept of the letter with our response to IP
by Mirjana Tasić Sept. 20, 2018

Sept. 20, 2018

Dear GP members, Please find here the concept of letter to IP which should accompany our document. Help me to improve it. Regards Mirjana Dear IP, Please find enclosed the response of Latin GP to your letter “Diacritics below a security risk?”. Latin GP cannot give the direct answer to your letter in this turn. Latin GP will appreciate very much if you could help us to clarify the questions we are discussing in our document sent as attachment in this message. We have face to face meeting in Brussels from October the 1st for three days. Your response to this document could help us to be more efficient and finalize our work. Best regards

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Re: [Latingp] ACTION NEEDED: New version of the response to IP on :Diacritics below a security risk?
by Tan Tanaka, Dennis Sept. 19, 2018

Sept. 19, 2018

Mirjana, I made some edits to the doc (in google docs) that may resolve the pending comments. Please review at your convenience. Thanks, Dennis From: Latingp <latingp-bounces(a)icann.org> on behalf of Mirjana Tasić <Mirjana.Tasic(a)rnids.rs> Date: Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 8:24 AM To: Latin GP <latingp(a)icann.org> Subject: [EXTERNAL] [Latingp] ACTION NEEDED: New version of the response to IP on :Diacritics below a security risk? Dear GP members, We have to send our response to this letter from IP as soon as possible. Please find in the attachment the response I tried to compile. Your feedback is expected till Monday. We need IP response till our F2F meeting in Brussels. I cannot resolve now Meikal and Bill comments, although I have commented it in the document https://docs.google.com/document/d/1MHSRol829bhBdxBXpdmYe0uxm-NwJ-EQb3gbOGI… My comment was “I want to remind you that scope of our work is now MSR3. We shall see the IP response to this letter. Anyway some of you, who will be present in Barcelona, will have the opportunity to discuss everything with IP members during 75 minutes working session of the Latin GP with IP open for the community, tentatively on Monday 22 Oct.” Regards Mirjana

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AGENDA for the GP call on September the 20th, 2018, 16:00UTC
by Mirjana Tasić Sept. 19, 2018

Sept. 19, 2018

Dear GP members. Please find enclosed the Agenda proposal for our next telephone conference. Regards Mirjana AGENDA for the GP call on September the 20th, 2018, 16:00UTC 1. Roll call 2. Latin Generation Panel (GP) Meeting Notes from the meeting on 6 September 2018 3. Response to IP letter with subj: “Diacritics below a security risk?” Old document https://docs.google.com/document/d/1MHSRol829bhBdxBXpdmYe0uxm-NwJ-EQb3gbOGI… New document- parts, where different opinions in comments are presented, are left unchanged. Table at the end of the document with pairs of code points is removed, because all code point from this table are included in 1) and 2) https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KkiIgKKU7NW6hdiY2zUVWfay2mHvIBMHwwrsD0U… 1. Agenda proposal for Brussels meeting https://docs.google.com/document/d/1x9dyANStvtcp6t0-3C4V-apMQqwjQRH89-CrYXC… 1. Presentations at ICANN 63 · A 75 minutes working session of the Latin GP with IP open for the community, tentatively on Monday 22 Oct. · A 7 minutes update during the session on IDN Program Update, tentatively on Wednesday 24 Oct. 1. Remainder- ICANN EXPECTED STANDARDS OF BEHAVIOR https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/expected-standards-15sep16-en.p… 1. AOB

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Re: [Latingp] ACTION NEEDED: New version of the response to IP on :Diacritics below a security risk?
by Tan Tanaka, Dennis Sept. 18, 2018

Sept. 18, 2018

+1 Mirjana and Michael. Upper case questions should be out of scope, as well as handwritten visual similarity cases. In the interest of time, I'm ok with sending the draft as it is, though. Mirjana, your call. @Meikal Mumin are these the docs you were asking about? If you are looking for the worksheets, these docs have a link to those, at the top of each document. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jQz-X7wk_Um-vpL2D2PjaTEs2Iq7zGVJd8PCt0A… https://docs.google.com/document/d/1FUPNDwJUq9cvHAqgIIzpgAYeaLhmbdDwsr0mgi4… https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ontc-amdQ_dFCRCc9oHBvotjwIhYc8xEM1OBn5y… -Dennis On 9/18/18, 5:48 AM, "Latingp on behalf of Mirjana Tasić" <latingp-bounces(a)icann.org on behalf of Mirjana.Tasic(a)rnids.rs> wrote: Dear Latin GP members, I have accepted all changes. Please look at the last version of the response. I also agree with Michael that upper case letters and handwritten characters are not in the scope of Latin GP, but as we have urgent need to move forward, I am proposing to send the letter as it is now. We need this answer as soon as possible, otherwise we cannot expect the answer to come on time for our Brussels meeting. Regards Mirjana On 9/18/18, 09:03, "Latingp on behalf of Michael Bauland" <latingp-bounces(a)icann.org on behalf of Michael.Bauland(a)knipp.de> wrote: Dear all, in general I agree with Meikal's changes, which might serve as a compromise between Dennis' and Bill's views. I think it's better to add some more examples in order to clarify our problems. Nevertheless, I commented to remove some paragraphs, as those would distract the IP from the (in my point of view) important cases: upper case and handwritten letters are out of scope for us, and there is no use for us asking about them again. Best regards, Michael -- ____________________________________________________________________ | | | knipp | Knipp Medien und Kommunikation GmbH ------- Technologiepark Martin-Schmeisser-Weg 9 44227 Dortmund Germany Dipl.-Informatiker Fon: +49 231 9703-0 Fax: +49 231 9703-200 Dr. Michael Bauland SIP: Michael.Bauland(a)knipp.de Software Development E-mail: Michael.Bauland(a)knipp.de Register Court: Amtsgericht Dortmund, HRB 13728 Chief Executive Officers: Dietmar Knipp, Elmar Knipp _______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp(a)icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp _______________________________________________ Latingp mailing list Latingp(a)icann.org https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/latingp

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